Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-17-2010, 08:38 PM
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Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: Boeing Boss
Posts: 335
Carl has done well this Summer. So have I. The focus should be on the next contract...not the last one.
09-17-2010, 08:55 PM
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Joined APC: May 2010
Position: bartender
Posts: 295
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
OK Clamp, here is how I back this up:
NWA 2008: 179.34/hour X 75 hours = $13,450
DAL 2008: 191.13/hour X 70 hours = $13,379
Just in the rate of pay difference alone, NWA guys started out with a cut. Add to that the other differences in minimum pay guarantee, minimum day, much higher insurance premiums and the pay was a real shock to some of us.
NWA 2009: 182.03/hour X 75 hours = $13,652
DAL 2009: 200.69/hour X 70 hours = $14,048
For most of us, this $400 pay increase per month offset the higher insurance premiums and went a long way toward offsetting the worse work rules. In 2009, we're getting pretty close to where we were at NWA.
NWA 2010: 184.76/hour X 75 hours = $13,857
DAL 2010: 208.72/hour X 70 hours = $14,610
This is about $800 per month more and will probably mean that 2010 will have me exceeding my 2008 W2 by just a whisker. I say that because in 2008 I had 5 over 80 hour months with time and a half pay. In 2010, I've gotten one straight pay extra trip this year.
This is just my example, and I'm sure others have similar ones. Senior guys probably did better quicker because of luck with green slips. Middle of the roaders like me didn't get much. Junior guys in category are still behind 2008's W2.
Carl
NWA 2008: 179.34/hour X 75 hours = $13,450
DAL 2008: 191.13/hour X 70 hours = $13,379
Just in the rate of pay difference alone, NWA guys started out with a cut. Add to that the other differences in minimum pay guarantee, minimum day, much higher insurance premiums and the pay was a real shock to some of us.
NWA 2009: 182.03/hour X 75 hours = $13,652
DAL 2009: 200.69/hour X 70 hours = $14,048
For most of us, this $400 pay increase per month offset the higher insurance premiums and went a long way toward offsetting the worse work rules. In 2009, we're getting pretty close to where we were at NWA.
NWA 2010: 184.76/hour X 75 hours = $13,857
DAL 2010: 208.72/hour X 70 hours = $14,610
This is about $800 per month more and will probably mean that 2010 will have me exceeding my 2008 W2 by just a whisker. I say that because in 2008 I had 5 over 80 hour months with time and a half pay. In 2010, I've gotten one straight pay extra trip this year.
This is just my example, and I'm sure others have similar ones. Senior guys probably did better quicker because of luck with green slips. Middle of the roaders like me didn't get much. Junior guys in category are still behind 2008's W2.
Carl
09-17-2010, 09:08 PM
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Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: B-7ER JFK
Posts: 931
Originally Posted by Ferd149
Only this one
Your welcome................don't mention it...........really
Ferd <----------found this keeper with a search of Euro-somethings...............what was it...............heheheheheh
Your welcome................don't mention it...........really
Ferd <----------found this keeper with a search of Euro-somethings...............what was it...............heheheheheh
What a hottie...
09-17-2010, 09:20 PM
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Woah fellas. How did we get going down this road again? For the record:
-- I will never be able to tell slowplay and sailingfun apart. One of those guys has to change their name.
-- I too am on track to make less under the this the new PWA. Why?
It's hard to put a finger on. But, I think:
1.) Having to sit reserve some months out of the year really hurts. 70's hours is low. Paying for hotels suck. Less per diem adds up. Not knowing how many lines the company is going to give out month over month is pretty bad, too. I sat reserve one month because I had vacation during the wrong week even though I was almost 60% up the list.
2.) While my pay rate has increased, it seems to be way harder to get trips to fill my schedule out. I'm sure I suck at monthly bidding, but several months, when I did hold a line, I only got 67 hours or so. Apparently, these were the slow, pre-summer months, when open time was scarce and the trips that were out there didn't match my schedule.
3.) While I admit that there are ways to make up for previously lost flying, it's not always guaranteed. Green slips, yellow slips, white slips, and rolling thunder sounds good, but I have found that unless you are very senior in your position and/or live in base, it is not something you can count on. I have tried that rolling thunder thing and can tell you that my thunder doesn't roll. I've called scheduling and asked if they thought it would roll. Flown into DTW to sit all day to wait for it to roll. Then flown back home when it didn't roll. Personally, I think my thunder has square wheels.
Don't get me wrong. There are many good and even great parts of the contract. But, from where I sit, I think if you talk to a fNWA guys who says he isn't making as much money, it might be because of where he sits in his/her category list, if he lives in base, or if his category is short on pilots.
From talking to folks around campus, I think so far this year, 330 A & B's, 7er B's, 320 A & B's, DC-9 B's, and some 744 B's can make a killing. They must be short in those category's. Green slips, white slips, rolling thunder or whatever they want, if they want, all day long. Even more so, if they live in base. But, for those of us that commute to work, who are around the 60-70% mark of our category, it's kind of tough to figure out. Or, at least it is for me. Some months I might have to sit reserve because I have vacation. Some months there will be slim pickings for open time. Hopefully, some months I will have a great schedule.
I'm sure I will figure it out, though. But, don't be so surprised when you hear fNWA say we aren't doing quite as well as you think we are. It's true. But, I always open to suggestions on how to improve my paycheck and quality of life. Fire away and thanks in advance.
New K Now
-- I will never be able to tell slowplay and sailingfun apart. One of those guys has to change their name.
-- I too am on track to make less under the this the new PWA. Why?
It's hard to put a finger on. But, I think:
1.) Having to sit reserve some months out of the year really hurts. 70's hours is low. Paying for hotels suck. Less per diem adds up. Not knowing how many lines the company is going to give out month over month is pretty bad, too. I sat reserve one month because I had vacation during the wrong week even though I was almost 60% up the list.
2.) While my pay rate has increased, it seems to be way harder to get trips to fill my schedule out. I'm sure I suck at monthly bidding, but several months, when I did hold a line, I only got 67 hours or so. Apparently, these were the slow, pre-summer months, when open time was scarce and the trips that were out there didn't match my schedule.
3.) While I admit that there are ways to make up for previously lost flying, it's not always guaranteed. Green slips, yellow slips, white slips, and rolling thunder sounds good, but I have found that unless you are very senior in your position and/or live in base, it is not something you can count on. I have tried that rolling thunder thing and can tell you that my thunder doesn't roll. I've called scheduling and asked if they thought it would roll. Flown into DTW to sit all day to wait for it to roll. Then flown back home when it didn't roll. Personally, I think my thunder has square wheels.
Don't get me wrong. There are many good and even great parts of the contract. But, from where I sit, I think if you talk to a fNWA guys who says he isn't making as much money, it might be because of where he sits in his/her category list, if he lives in base, or if his category is short on pilots.
From talking to folks around campus, I think so far this year, 330 A & B's, 7er B's, 320 A & B's, DC-9 B's, and some 744 B's can make a killing. They must be short in those category's. Green slips, white slips, rolling thunder or whatever they want, if they want, all day long. Even more so, if they live in base. But, for those of us that commute to work, who are around the 60-70% mark of our category, it's kind of tough to figure out. Or, at least it is for me. Some months I might have to sit reserve because I have vacation. Some months there will be slim pickings for open time. Hopefully, some months I will have a great schedule.
I'm sure I will figure it out, though. But, don't be so surprised when you hear fNWA say we aren't doing quite as well as you think we are. It's true. But, I always open to suggestions on how to improve my paycheck and quality of life. Fire away and thanks in advance.
New K Now
09-17-2010, 09:36 PM
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Joined APC: May 2010
Position: bartender
Posts: 295
Originally Posted by newKnow
Woah fellas. How did we get going down this road again? For the record:
-- I will never be able to tell slowplay and sailingfun apart. One of those guys has to change their name.
-- I too am on track to make less under the this the new PWA. Why?
It's hard to put a finger on. But, I think:
1.) Having to sit reserve some months out of the year really hurts. 70's hours is low. Paying for hotels suck. Less per diem adds up. Not knowing how many lines the company is going to give out month over month is pretty bad, too. I sat reserve one month because I had vacation during the wrong week even though I was almost 60% up the list.
2.) While my pay rate has increased, it seems to be way harder to get trips to fill my schedule out. I'm sure I suck at monthly bidding, but several months, when I did hold a line, I only got 67 hours or so. Apparently, these were the slow, pre-summer months, when open time was scarce and the trips that were out there didn't match my schedule.
3.) While I admit that there are ways to make up for previously lost flying, it's not always guaranteed. Green slips, yellow slips, white slips, and rolling thunder sounds good, but I have found that unless you are very senior in your position and/or live in base, it is not something you can count on. I have tried that rolling thunder thing and can tell you that my thunder doesn't roll. I've called scheduling and asked if they thought it would roll. Flown into DTW to sit all day to wait for it to roll. Then flown back home when it didn't roll. Personally, I think my thunder has square wheels.
Don't get me wrong. There are many good and even great parts of the contract. But, from where I sit, I think if you talk to a fNWA guys who says he isn't making as much money, it might be because of where he sits in his/her category list, if he lives in base, or if his category is short on pilots.
330 B's, 7er B's, and 320 A & B's, DC-9 B's, and some 744 B's can make a killing. Green slips, white slips, rolling thunder or whatever they want, if they want. Even more so, if they live in base. But, for those of us who are around the 60-70% mark of our category, it's kind of tough to figure out. Or, at least it is for me. Some months I might have to sit reserve because I have vacation. Some months there will be slim pickings for open time.
I'm sure I will figure it out, though. But, don't be so surprised when you hear us say we aren't doing quite as well as you think we are. It's true. But, I always open to suggestions on how to improve my paycheck and quality of life. Fire away.
New K Now
-- I will never be able to tell slowplay and sailingfun apart. One of those guys has to change their name.
-- I too am on track to make less under the this the new PWA. Why?
It's hard to put a finger on. But, I think:
1.) Having to sit reserve some months out of the year really hurts. 70's hours is low. Paying for hotels suck. Less per diem adds up. Not knowing how many lines the company is going to give out month over month is pretty bad, too. I sat reserve one month because I had vacation during the wrong week even though I was almost 60% up the list.
2.) While my pay rate has increased, it seems to be way harder to get trips to fill my schedule out. I'm sure I suck at monthly bidding, but several months, when I did hold a line, I only got 67 hours or so. Apparently, these were the slow, pre-summer months, when open time was scarce and the trips that were out there didn't match my schedule.
3.) While I admit that there are ways to make up for previously lost flying, it's not always guaranteed. Green slips, yellow slips, white slips, and rolling thunder sounds good, but I have found that unless you are very senior in your position and/or live in base, it is not something you can count on. I have tried that rolling thunder thing and can tell you that my thunder doesn't roll. I've called scheduling and asked if they thought it would roll. Flown into DTW to sit all day to wait for it to roll. Then flown back home when it didn't roll. Personally, I think my thunder has square wheels.
Don't get me wrong. There are many good and even great parts of the contract. But, from where I sit, I think if you talk to a fNWA guys who says he isn't making as much money, it might be because of where he sits in his/her category list, if he lives in base, or if his category is short on pilots.
330 B's, 7er B's, and 320 A & B's, DC-9 B's, and some 744 B's can make a killing. Green slips, white slips, rolling thunder or whatever they want, if they want. Even more so, if they live in base. But, for those of us who are around the 60-70% mark of our category, it's kind of tough to figure out. Or, at least it is for me. Some months I might have to sit reserve because I have vacation. Some months there will be slim pickings for open time.
I'm sure I will figure it out, though. But, don't be so surprised when you hear us say we aren't doing quite as well as you think we are. It's true. But, I always open to suggestions on how to improve my paycheck and quality of life. Fire away.
New K Now
09-17-2010, 09:46 PM
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
newK-
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
09-17-2010, 09:56 PM
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Originally Posted by JABDIP
New K you are right on here. What we are talking about is ALV. If you look at ALV and forget about the privy few that can get a GS, You are making the same or less. I really don't care about this except when it is thrown out that we got this huge pay raise. Most of us got a small pay cut and a decline in QOL. I think the overall result of the merger is positive, but don't be the one to tell me how much better my life is now that I'm a DAL pilot. I certainly hope that it gets better.
In 2001, a DC-9 Captain for NWA and made $166 per hour.
In 2010, a DC-9 A for DAL makes $150 per hour.
Neither side should be bragging about what we had in 2007 or what we have today. Hell, there aren't even sides anymore. Let's just make this work until it's time to really get paid.
Last edited by newKnow; 09-18-2010 at 06:08 AM.
09-17-2010, 09:59 PM
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Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: B-7ER JFK
Posts: 931
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
newK-
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
I attempted this lately but rolled like News wheels, however, I have heard guys making good $$$ that way. I guess I need a different strategy (again)...
09-17-2010, 10:02 PM
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
newK-
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
A hint for the master: Vacation months you can make huge money...especially if you stack two weeks against each other. Max yourself out outside the vacation with pickups and greenslips and breaking 100 to 110 hours is no sweat.
No seriously. I was actually sick for both of my vacation months. Not pineappleguy condemnation sick either. The real thing. I will do that the next time though. Thanks 80!
09-17-2010, 10:05 PM
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
That stinks about being sick. Always happens in time off!... just sent you a text. It only works if youre holding a line in your vacation month. I tagged 108 hours in August without a single greenslip and still had 19 days off.
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