John Carr

Sad truth.

XJT’s CPP is similar/same.

Meaning, many that were at XJT for the dark decade (and more) were turned down, just cuz...

Meanwhile, some of the most deficient/most avoided made it ��

Casualinterest

I think the issue for most is that it represents a way for pilots to get hired here and progress to Delta faster than people already here, many of whom went to the same school(s). There's no hard requirement for the propel applicants to spend 18 months as Captain like the DGI. Only that they "take the first available upgrade" and even that is not a hard limit. Which means that theoretically someone could get hired by G7 or OO and get a lighting fast upgrade then leave before a 9E pilot with the exact same qualifications even upgrades. Remember, we're still running 2+ year upgrades right now from the last 2 vacancies. Sure that'll come down, but the scenario exists where a propel applicant with the exact same education and experience as a 9E pilot one year older would get to Delta before him.

Take the words "career progression" out of the sentence and it's easy to understand why some people (and ALPA) have genuine concerns. "New pilots on property are being offered better ______ than existing pilots with similar qualifications".

And to those who say "It will never be big enough to impact off the street hiring". You're being purposely naive. That's the whole point of this, to reduce pressure on the OTS hiring goals over the next few years. And if it's 1 pilot or 1000 pilots that's still a whole group of people that get to skip the line on a bunch of other people.

Don't forget one of the biggest problems with this that has barely been addressed. All of the gains in the past 10 years by regionals in terms of pay and benefits have been due to leverage the pilot group has from the labor "shortage". Any program that gets pilots less invested in the success of the unions negotiating position diminish the leverage we have to ever improve things like career progression for the rest of us. It just serves to further fracture the pilot group. Look at how long it takes the AA WO's to get gains. When half the pilot group has one foot out the door it's damn near impossible to get a strong negotiating position.

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Mesabah

Propel is bad for pilots OTS, but in reality it has zero effect on 9E.

RJdriver89

My biggest problem with the program relates to those of us who went to the same Universities and Colleges that are now included in the propel program. Right place, wrong time.

I understand this industry is all about being in the right place at the right time (and having connections) however this is different. We essentially have the same education, same flight training and more industry experience with less defined career progression.

I will be the first to admit we are owed nothing in life and am completely happy with my position here at Endeavor. I just feel this is an unfair advantage for those who proceed myself and the many others here that are alumnus from these institutions. The future is still bright and I feel we will all land where we want (pun intended). Just wanted to voice my opinion.

UncreativeUser

I’m just gonna chime in here and say this.

I went to a university that has propel and I graduated. The grace period after graduation is 6 months. I graduated 7- months after it was announced.

Let me put it this way. I buster my butt hard and got all my railings and degree within the 4 year time frame while my buddies who took 1 year GOT the propel program because they didn’t graduate yet. So essentially, had I slacked off I would be set but now I get to see my friends who were out busy getting hammered instead of studying and kept delaying their stage checks to the point it held them back a semester get to be at a major before people like myself. I am not the only one on this scenario.

But hey, timing right?


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GuardPolice

Unless you misspoke, if you graduated 7 months after Propel was announced/started, you were eligible to apply.

But, I think you meant you graduated 7 months before...correct?

Regardless, I know the timing sucks but they set out knowing there would be people like you who would not be eligible due to said bad timing. Unfortunately, given the history of this industry this statistically won’t be the only time a case of bad timing strikes.

Lastly, if your buddy is as much of a slacker as you say he’ll get weeded out. Nothing is guaranteed for him for several more years. Or, more likely, he realizes the opportunity before him and will take full advantage of it and turn things around and get focused.


GP

GuardPolice

The Propel folks had to create an arbitrary cutoff to get the program off the ground. They are fully aware a lot of good candidates would be missed with that decision.

I know that’s not a consolation prize but I can assure you it wasn’t an easy decision to have make that cutoff.


GP

Fourpaw

Welcome to the big D.




Hope you brought some lube.

VoiceOfReason

This reminds me of my wife's approach to playing slots in Vegas... "Well, that guy just hit a jackpot on this machine, so it must be hot!"

Focus on the things you can control, we proud that your buddy will have a chance to join you at mainline in the future. We all get shown the door at 65, so let's make the most of what we have in front of us.

UncreativeUser

Ahh! Yes I meant 7 months BEFORE but you were obviously smart to know what I meant.

Yes, won’t be the first orang and honestly my gripe is not the big of a deal when you compare to everyone circa 2001-2011



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