Green Needles

What does it even mean? The union has been talking about "guaranteed and contractual" for years. Why can't they share a real plan? Do they even have one? Is there a strategic reason to keep everything all secret squirrel?

I strongly support the effort to improve our path to Delta, but the lack of a visible and communicated plan is frustrating.

Fourpaw

First .

Mad Hatter

They don’t have a plan because they are powerless to get results. “We don’t want a flow, we just want a guaranteed number of Endeavor pilots to progress to Delta every month, contractually.” Isn’t that a flow? Someone prove me wrong. I see pilots who interviewed two or three times and didn’t get to mainline, so now this lanyard and no hat show will sway Delta management and they’ll gift you with a job? Accept the fact it didn’t work out. It’s unfortunate, very. However, there are plenty of other opportunities out there.

JulesWinfield

Feel free to contact a rep if you have questions. The basic premise is that Propel introduces two classes of pilots at Endeavor.

The idea the union has been floating is a system of hoops to jump through at Endeavor that, assuming you jump through the hoops, you get a job at Delta that is contractual.

Mad Hatter

And if you don’t jump through? How many pilots shows up totally unprepared for the interview and were not hired? Career progression for all who meet their expectations.

JulesWinfield

If you don't jump through the hoops, you wouldn't get the job. I have no idea who has shown up prepared or not. I'd like to think everyone has been prepared, but when our DGI is hovering around 50% and we have a ton of double no SSP guys, Propel is a slap in the face.

I understand the Propel hiring process is no joke, but we're all here flying Delta customers promoting the brand.

I think the hats off lanyards on thing is a big silly, but I am participating.

Varsity

Propel is a B scale.

JonGoodsell764

After having done this for many years I’ve learned a few things the hard way. One of them is that your regional “union” is powerless. ALPA is a mainline union. They will do what benefits their mainline carriers.

Second, it sounds as though propel is entirely unfair to the current seniority list pilot group. That much is clear. However, there is already a two class pilot system at 9E. Those who have been scorned by DAL, and those who have not. It doesn’t sound like your union has a plan because they don’t. The old guard wants flow because that’s the only way they’re getting to Delta. The younger group wants some sort of contractual DGI. Any sort of contractual progression would be entirely unfair to the 70% of the pilot group that hasn’t had one shot at DAL yet, let alone several.

If you’re an old dog, wear the lanyard. If you’ve been on property less than 5 years and are wearing it, why? You’re supporting something that would delay your movement to DAL. That’s how it seems to me as an outsider.

Avroman

I don't have a dog in this fight personally as I have no interest in working at Delta (or anywhere else at my age) anymore but I'd think we should be putting much more effort into career progression with some other airline. Why is everyone here so set on having to go to Delta? They have no interest in giving up their petty little games they play in ATL with their hiring. There are plenty of other airlines that (while maybe not the perfect end destination) are a step up from the regionals. What's wrong with talking to Allegiant, Frontier, or even places like JetBlue or Southwest? It amazes me how many FO's I've flown with that have blinders on for Delta with no backup if they get turned down.

Green Needles

We know it's a two class system, we know, we know, we know. I'm tired of the same lines from the union. I want to know what their plan is, if they even have one.

What is their end goal? What does their definition of a successful outcome of this campaign look like? I'm tired of hearing the vague "guaranteed and contractual" statement. We deserve to be told in concrete terms what they are shooting for. We also deserve to know if the other side is even willing to talk.

Until anyone can provide those details, there's no sense in repeating the same old crap. Every email from them on this says the same exact thing.