Endeavor Bonus to Pay Rates Discussion
12-24-2016, 11:46 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 776
I'm all for getting as much money as we possibly can for our services, but I am also mindful that this is a marathon and not a sprint. We need to ensure the airline survives in 15 years. That means not pricing ourselves out of the market.
Things are nice and dandy and candy and sunshine right now because ATL is making money...one economic downturn and they will be coming right back here for their money back. And if they don't like our costs or if we aren't competitive, we WILL be Comair'd.
I did union work for 6 years. I signed Disclosure Agreements, Saw debt obligation litigation, and spoke with CEOs and the like...the one thing I took away from my union work was---
Management does NOT and will NEVER see us as an asset.
We are simply a cost which MUST be controlled.
The quicker we can come to terms with this realization, the more you will understand about airline management and whipsaw.
Things are nice and dandy and candy and sunshine right now because ATL is making money...one economic downturn and they will be coming right back here for their money back. And if they don't like our costs or if we aren't competitive, we WILL be Comair'd.
I did union work for 6 years. I signed Disclosure Agreements, Saw debt obligation litigation, and spoke with CEOs and the like...the one thing I took away from my union work was---
Management does NOT and will NEVER see us as an asset.
We are simply a cost which MUST be controlled.
The quicker we can come to terms with this realization, the more you will understand about airline management and whipsaw.
12-24-2016, 11:56 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,559
Two years ago, I bet you would have said the very same thing about $60K.
The times, they are a-changin'!!
(I believe Kalitta just jumped from $62-ish to $101-ish for FYFO. SIgnificant pay raises are due all over. Why not demand as much as we can?)
The times, they are a-changin'!!
(I believe Kalitta just jumped from $62-ish to $101-ish for FYFO. SIgnificant pay raises are due all over. Why not demand as much as we can?)
Originally Posted by msprj2
Because 73/HR isn't realistic for a 50 seat FO 1st year pay rate.
12-24-2016, 12:48 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: CaptFo
Posts: 997
Originally Posted by HighFlight
Two years ago, I bet you would have said the very same thing about $60K.
The times, they are a-changin'!!
(I believe Kalitta just jumped from $62-ish to $101-ish for FYFO. SIgnificant pay raises are due all over. Why not demand as much as we can?)
The times, they are a-changin'!!
(I believe Kalitta just jumped from $62-ish to $101-ish for FYFO. SIgnificant pay raises are due all over. Why not demand as much as we can?)
12-24-2016, 01:17 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 480
Originally Posted by Yumyum
Exactly! We aren't asking for mainline wages. Honest question though...should a 2-3 year Legacy FO be making more than a 20 year regional Captain? I would like to hear everyone's opinion.
Idk man, who cares if it's right? Its legacy flying, they use cheap outsourced labor to make a mint and help contribute to an overall profit margin that helps the company that sells the tickets.
Sounds right to me.
12-24-2016, 01:34 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: CaptFo
Posts: 997
[QUOTE=JesuitValen;2269019]Should a 2-3 year legacy fo not in a bankruptcy contract make more than a 20 year regional captain not in a bankruptcy contract? You're asking if the way things are and always have been is right?
Idk man, who cares if it's right? Its legacy flying, they use cheap outsourced labor to make a mint and help contribute to an overall profit margin that helps the company that sells the
Because regional pilots are suckers!
Idk man, who cares if it's right? Its legacy flying, they use cheap outsourced labor to make a mint and help contribute to an overall profit margin that helps the company that sells the
Because regional pilots are suckers!
12-24-2016, 01:39 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2016
Posts: 1,237
Originally Posted by FreightWasScary
You think we don't decide the payrate? Know what you're worth man. I didn't come fly these darn RJ' till I could afford to support my family. Simple supply and demand actually. dont settle for less than you're worth. Well that's just you I guess. Keep Doing you.
12-24-2016, 01:45 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2016
Posts: 1,237
[QUOTE=Yumyum;2269028]
So should RG tell EB that he wants to be paid the same because they do the same job?
Originally Posted by JesuitValen
Should a 2-3 year legacy fo not in a bankruptcy contract make more than a 20 year regional captain not in a bankruptcy contract? You're asking if the way things are and always have been is right?
Idk man, who cares if it's right? Its legacy flying, they use cheap outsourced labor to make a mint and help contribute to an overall profit margin that helps the company that sells the
Because regional pilots are suckers!
Idk man, who cares if it's right? Its legacy flying, they use cheap outsourced labor to make a mint and help contribute to an overall profit margin that helps the company that sells the
Because regional pilots are suckers!
12-24-2016, 03:54 PM
#29
Banned
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 375
Originally Posted by 4myfamily
83/hr for first year FO on the 900 a 76 passenger airplane which equals $1.09 per seat. I know this is not a perfect assumption because there is no extra revenue for first class on a 200 but they are going away anyway. 50/76 = 66%. Sixty-six % of 1.09 = $.72 per seat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Oe8T3AvydU&t=132s
12-24-2016, 04:11 PM
#30
New Hire
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 2
Keep Whole Solution
Converting the bonus to permanent pay is SIMPLE.
Let the current bonus expire and replace it with a Base Salary of $958.33 per pay period, which equals $23,000 per year.
EVERYTHING ELSE stays the same. And everybody is kept whole. Nobody should find this objectionable; if anyone does then there's a hidden agenda.
Calculating 401K, life insurance, vacation pay, etc., etc., could factor in, or exclude, the Base Salary earned in order to keep the company and the employees whole.
Let the current bonus expire and replace it with a Base Salary of $958.33 per pay period, which equals $23,000 per year.
EVERYTHING ELSE stays the same. And everybody is kept whole. Nobody should find this objectionable; if anyone does then there's a hidden agenda.
Calculating 401K, life insurance, vacation pay, etc., etc., could factor in, or exclude, the Base Salary earned in order to keep the company and the employees whole.
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