Direct Entry 175 Captain
 

It’s official, folks. Envoy just posted a standing vacancy for 175 captain at Chicago. That should allow for direct entry captains. How that will be accomplished this time around remains to be seen.

Seems they're slowing down new-hire FO classes to get some captains moving along, it'll be interesting to see what the next couple months hold.

While I know they are desperate for captains, they shouldn’t completely ignore the cadets and non prior 121 pilots. It will end up biting them later. Probably a lot sooner than they might even think. (Although they’re not thinking about it at all, and that’s the problem.)

Problem is they don’t have instructors, last I heard we only had one or two ground instructors left, they’re getting APD’s and non-ground instructors to teach ground now…

That’s why they are throwing ludicrous amounts of money around to get people to stay or at least get a few more off the sidelines. Not sure what they are offering for the non seniority list instructors.

The problem is that a lot of the “lifer” instructors, the apds, etc aren’t getting anything new since they decided to not flow when it was their time, and their plans to leave to flight safety etc haven’t changed.

Not true. The new contract/extension included increased monthly hours for those positions. Also the base was still bumped up and they are receiving the 50% premium increase until Aug 2024. They may have seen the smallest increase, but they are still seeing a significant windfall, and not just the premium. I think this is also likely to pull some of the lifer into some of those positions that have previously avoided them or have taken a break from them.

Could someone tell me (I know it’s a guess) how long it’s looking for someone who is hired today as an FO, but meets 121 PIC minimums, to hold a Captain slot? Thanx

Check back in a few days when the next bid runs. It will give an indication of how junior captain spots are going. In the most recent past, they have moved away from actual DECs and made everyone go through as an FO and then do upgrade. Not necessarily a bad thing as it gives you time to figure out the company and since you have the hours still get the captain pay anyway and with only the 175, you won’t have to worry about a plane swap and the upgrade will be a shorter “qualified” upgrade.

THANKS for this!

As recently as last month, when I asked about getting at least a couple of months/a hundred hours or so in the right seat (as a potential DEC with the requisite number of 121 hours, but no Pax experience) the emphatic (but polite) answer from both PSA as well as Envoy was (my paraphrasing): "You'll be hired as a CA, trained as a CA, and then we'll get you straight into the left seat to start flying the line as a CA."

And when I drilled down on that, it was explained that "regular" DECs would get 50 hours of IOE... but those DECs that hadn't logged 121 time in the past 5 years would have the opportunity to fly 300 hours in the right seat before moving to the left.

I asked if either WO would make an exception to the "straight into the left seat" paradigm... neither would.

Seems like (now) they might... so many thanks again for the update!

Ok thanks. Yeah I agree. In fact I’ll sit in the FA seat for Captain pay if that’s what they want me to do, lol.

No offense, but envoy has had some pretty rough DEC’s in the past so it’s understandable why there is a 300 hour wait to slide you over when you’ve never flown 121 passenger flights. Last thing they want is a 175 descending into GJT at a high rate again. RW and RN probably are under scrutiny still from past issues.

My bad for the miscommunication... truly so.

On this end (as a potential DEC) I *was asking for* a couple of hundred hours in the right seat (before making the move to the left)... but both Envoy and PSA told me that it wasn't an option for me because I have recent 121 time (albeit in a non-pax environment).

And because of that I've not pursued either option.

That being said, if they've (now) revised things, and are (now) allowing DECs to fly as a FO for a while... I'm all for it and will reach out to their recruiters to make sure that it's become the "official" policy/training tract.

Anyway, hope that clears up the perspective from this end... and yup, if anyone could point me towards a source (or pilot recruiter) that could confirm there's (now) the chance to learn the a/c, learn the airline, learn the Pax world, from the "right seat first"... *before* making the DEC move to the left, it would be most appreciated. :-)

Many thanks!

This. But people seem to have a short memory and the company (all of them) are under pressure to fill seats.