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Old 07-07-2019, 12:51 PM   #221  
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Originally Posted by StarClipper View Post
Iíve ask the question numerous times and none of the union reps are able to give answer. One rep said itís not wasnít a big issue seen only a small percentage of guys are affected in such areas.
So if you now of any provisions, please feel free to share.
A union rep said that LTD "Wasn't a big issue"? They need a wakeup call... That is a huge essentially "insurance" benefit for us that is a huge deal to all, and has the potential to effect any of us at anytime and therefore all of us all the time. There is no doubt in my mind we (ALPA) will mess this up if we allow them to institute the new VBplan. The Law of unintended consequences are still haunting us from CBA15.

Leave our retirement language alone, increase the numbers only (that is safe). Increase the BPlan enough with cash over cap, and we can safely solve the inflation issue imposed by our APlan cap. The reason ALPA leaders don't want this vs the VBplan is because they don't see the Bplan raise as a big enough win for guys who are very senior but only have a few years to go before retirement (even though there Aplan is worth 130K in todays dollars).
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Old 07-07-2019, 03:03 PM   #222  
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Originally Posted by Flaps50 View Post
A union rep said that LTD "Wasn't a big issue"? They need a wakeup call... That is a huge essentially "insurance" benefit for us that is a huge deal to all, and has the potential to effect any of us at anytime and therefore all of us all the time. There is no doubt in my mind we (ALPA) will mess this up if we allow them to institute the new VBplan. The Law of unintended consequences are still haunting us from CBA15.

Leave our retirement language alone, increase the numbers only (that is safe). Increase the BPlan enough with cash over cap, and we can safely solve the inflation issue imposed by our APlan cap. The reason ALPA leaders don't want this vs the VBplan is because they don't see the Bplan raise as a big enough win for guys who are very senior but only have a few years to go before retirement (even though there Aplan is worth 130K in todays dollars).
If LTD is not a huge issue then lets vote a few out or stop paying dues. I still say a voting a few out amd instilling term limits and requirning them to fly will send a clear signal.

They need to fly and hear from the masses. Not stay seated in their plush desks jobs and have expensive lunches.
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Old 07-07-2019, 04:42 PM   #223  
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If LTD is not a huge issue then lets vote a few out or stop paying dues. I still say a voting a few out amd instilling term limits and requirning them to fly will send a clear signal.



They need to fly and hear from the masses. Not stay seated in their plush desks jobs and have expensive lunches.


This guy is striking me as a troll. Lots of provocative stir-the-pot posts without any purpose other than sowing division against ďthe unionĒ. Stop paying dues? How do you do that, pray tell? I donít mind contrary opinions and general complaining but this guy seems like another starclipper.


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Old 07-07-2019, 05:34 PM   #224  
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This guy is striking me as a troll. Lots of provocative stir-the-pot posts without any purpose other than sowing division against ďthe unionĒ. Stop paying dues? How do you do that, pray tell? I donít mind contrary opinions and general complaining but this guy seems like another starclipper.


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My post are not to troll or stir up any pot. Go back and read them all, like you I voice my opinion. And yes I donít trust the union.
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:06 PM   #225  
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This guy is striking me as a troll. Lots of provocative stir-the-pot posts without any purpose other than sowing division against “the union”. Stop paying dues? How do you do that, pray tell? I don’t mind contrary opinions and general complaining but this guy seems like another starclipper.


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I don't trust the Union and I stand by voting out a few. They need to fly not sit behind the desks. What solution do you have?

If you read the other posts there is a lot of valuable information. Yes, you have to get past the pot stirring and *****ing. maybe our Union reps should pay attention. The new retirment plan the MEC wants passed I benefit from but what are ALL the details. Once the DB is given up we will never get it back. Right now my answer and vote are no to cherons beautiful retirement world. This reasearch is costing us more than $8000,000 and if I am not mistaken the video says that cheron is doing this for free. Dont we have a contract coming up in 2020?

Maybe you can provide what the real reason why the variable retirement plan is in the company’s hands now and why we are not negotiating for an increase in the 401k?
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:44 PM   #226  
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Originally Posted by hoya saxa View Post
This guy is striking me as a troll. Lots of provocative stir-the-pot posts without any purpose other than sowing division against ďthe unionĒ. Stop paying dues? How do you do that, pray tell? I donít mind contrary opinions and general complaining but this guy seems like another starclipper.
Interesting. Maybe even one and the same?
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Old 07-08-2019, 01:30 AM   #227  
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Originally Posted by KenandDeglan View Post
I don't trust the Union and I stand by voting out a few. They need to fly not sit behind the desks. What solution do you have?

If you read the other posts there is a lot of valuable information. Yes, you have to get past the pot stirring and *****ing. maybe our Union reps should pay attention. The new retirment plan the MEC wants passed I benefit from but what are ALL the details. Once the DB is given up we will never get it back. Right now my answer and vote are no to cherons beautiful retirement world. This reasearch is costing us more than $8000,000 and if I am not mistaken the video says that cheron is doing this for free. Dont we have a contract coming up in 2020?

Maybe you can provide what the real reason why the variable retirement plan is in the companyís hands now and why we are not negotiating for an increase in the 401k?
No...

Filler
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Old 07-08-2019, 04:53 AM   #228  
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But Kronanís entire argument is built on the basis of the accuracy of this garbage modeler. And then just to make the rainbows brighter, a bunch of ďto be negotiatedĒ provisions..
Here's the thing, I know what I make now. I know what I expect to make this year, as well as 2021.

I know what the IRS limits are now, all I can do is WAG what they will be next year, and Cap these notional contributions accordingly.

Really not difficult to make a Spreadsheet that tabulates 2% of my predicted earnings. The starting verbiage of this plan was a pilot getting The Higher of the 2% floor or Market returns in Excess of a 5% hurdle. (The recent add on verbiage to the plan is a pilot will get the Higher of the 2% floor, Returns on Market, or the 2%*YOS*High 5 a Pilot would accrue under our current pension)


The Legalese Verbiage is about Predicted Returns above 5%. The Very Far right bar of the model shows a range of Pension values. The base value is the Floor, the next color is the likely returns, the very top segment is the historically possible returns but unlikely. Don't remember the % but it's something along the lines of these market returns occur 3-5% of the time
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Old 07-08-2019, 04:59 AM   #229  
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Has it definitively been stated that there is no provision for this LTD benefit? If so, can you point me to that statement?
What has been said is that we are aware of the issue and LTD protection is part of the plan.

Exactly HOW it's addressed, hasn't been communicated.

I would say, an example of going out for 10 years and then coming back....is pretty unlikely. No real feel for it, but most of the guys I've flown with have been out 12-18 months and then returned.
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Old 07-08-2019, 05:03 AM   #230  
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And for that we lose PGBC coverage. Which is nice.
We do NOT lose PBGC coverage. VB plan is governed by IRS regulations, lots of reporting requirements, and is still covered by PBGC

(Current PBGC Max pensions based on the year you begin collecting the protected pension)
60-43.7k
61-48.4k
62-53.2k
63-57.9k
64-62.6k
65-67.3k
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