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Originally Posted by C2078
(Post 2937948)
I never get why people post inaccurate information. To put down a “competitor”? A peer? To chest pump and make themselves look better?
Our DB flat dollar amount goes out to 2026, yes, 5 years beyond amendable date (we will have a new CBA by then, this was done to protect against protracted negotiations). It goes up to $4,200 x years of service. And Boiler is right, it only takes ONE segment as a fully qualified Captain to obtain the $4,200 amount. Whoever does not retire with the Captain FDA is BY CHOICE!! Because EVERY pilot that is retiring soon can be a Captain. Why doesn’t Kronan post the full picture. The ABSOLUTE MAX pension at Fedex is $130k, after 25 years. UPS is $126k after 30. What Kronan omits (advantageously) is the DC of 12% vs 8% (going to 9% for Fedex). And, UPS pension was negotiated and now tied to senior management’s pension plan, meaning they would have to cancel/terminate/reduce theirs in order to affect ours. Again, both great benefits, why put down one or the other? To gloat? Chest pump? Chest “pump”? Is English your first language? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
The UPS flat dollar amount defined benefit is not perfect or a panacea...but it *could* be a means to an increased defined benefit at FDX without the divisive act of excluding newhires.
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Originally Posted by USMCFDX
(Post 2935467)
Increase the B fund and add cash over cap. Every time you get a pay raise your retirement savings increases as well.
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Originally Posted by seefive
(Post 2938032)
Exactly!!!!!
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Originally Posted by BoilerUP
(Post 2936124)
Yes, you are mistaken.
Max YOS toward our defined benefit is 30, whereas FedEx is 25. That said, flying 25 years at UPS and never upgrading to CA would be a choice, especially as the junior CA on our last bid went to people with less than 4.5 years on property. Get released to the line, fly a single turn as Captain, and you are entitled to a Captain FDA benefit. Your point is valid, though, that FDX career FOs who never check out as Captains would have a more lucrative defined benefit under your 2% FAE than our FDA. Lots of ways to improve retirement benefits that don't involve a non-bankruptcy, pilot-ratified retirement B-Scale that introduces a natural and significant division point in your pilot group. Your negotiations, not ours...but none of us bargain in a vacuum. More than One FedEx guy has gone out on a medical issue and never returned, would assume the same is true at UPS. (Hope that's not construed as UPS bashing) ;-) |
Originally Posted by USMCFDX
(Post 2935467)
Increase the B fund and add cash over cap. Every time you get a pay raise your retirement savings increases as well.
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Originally Posted by StarClipper
(Post 2938002)
Because he is one of our Union sympathizer who tries to justify everything they do.
Realizing there are seldom 100% success stories in Any Union negotiation, but knowing there are only Two Teams in a negotiation. |
Originally Posted by C2078
(Post 2937948)
I never get why people post inaccurate information. To put down a “competitor”? A peer? To chest pump and make themselves look better?
Our DB flat dollar amount goes out to 2026, yes, 5 years beyond amendable date (we will have a new CBA by then, this was done to protect against protracted negotiations). It goes up to $4,200 x years of service. And Boiler is right, it only takes ONE segment as a fully qualified Captain to obtain the $4,200 amount. Whoever does not retire with the Captain FDA is BY CHOICE!! Because EVERY pilot that is retiring soon can be a Captain. Why doesn’t Kronan post the full picture. The ABSOLUTE MAX pension at Fedex is $130k, after 25 years. UPS is $126k after 30. What Kronan omits (advantageously) is the DC of 12% vs 8% (going to 9% for Fedex). And, UPS pension was negotiated and now tied to senior management’s pension plan, meaning they would have to cancel/terminate/reduce theirs in order to affect ours. Again, both great benefits, why put down one or the other? To gloat? Chest pump? And a deliberate error? When I said that I didn't think the FDA went up this coming year as well as the next? That's what you view as inaccurate information? And what You Omit (advantageously) is the DC contribution many FedEx pilots gain as a result of maxed out Disability banks. The opportunity to add another 72CHs year after year is far greater than the differential between 12% and 9%. Several years ago did the math. The advantage of an extra 3%, subject to the same DC Cap, doesn't outweigh the 2% * YOS FedEx Pension until about year 28. So, yes, for those Pilots fortunate enough to have been hired at an age where they can have 28+ YOS, UPS combined A&B plan is likely better. Tough to plan on the 72CHs because at least Some people wind up using much of the bank due to various injuries over the years. But a significant portion don't, and Do benefit by that Contract provision. Just as I think it's quite likely that more FedEx pilots upgrade to Capt earlier, again throwing that B plan calculation awry. For ease of Math, to error check my assertions, the absolute Maximum difference between our B plans happens at the DC limit, or 285k next year. At 12% that's $34,200 as compared to FedEx's $25,650 or a difference of $8,550 So, Running that from year one for 25 years at 6.5% equals $518,687 (not accurate because it's not accounting for the increases in the DC limit over time, but also not accurate because year 1 a UPS pilot isn't putting 34k into the B plan) At a 4% withdrawal rate, that amounts to an extra $20,748 in cashflow for our UPS brethren. Or a cash flow of $125,748. (25 YOS*4.2=105k) As opposed to our FedEx FO or Capt who will have $130,000. That's the straight life amount, unadjusted for the cost of a survivor's benefit. But then again, I assume the 105k from UPS is also a straight life benefit. For those who want to consider the benefits of a Full DSA bank\excess payment. 72 hours equals $23,184 $19,944 $16,344 $14,328 Respectively, based on Year 11 pay |
Originally Posted by kronan
(Post 2938300)
And what You Omit (advantageously) is the DC contribution many FedEx pilots gain as a result of maxed out Disability banks. The opportunity to add another 72CHs year after year is far greater than the differential between 12% and 9%. |
Originally Posted by USMCFDX
(Post 2938321)
Are you seriously suggesting that this is part of our retirement compensation?
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