Noworkallplay

Another thing I found funny is the people who are posting in opposition to the VB Pension. They have been around FDX for 8-30 years. They had 0 success in the past moving the bar on our current pension. They only got band aid fixes for small portions of the group much like what UPS just did. Yet they thump their chest that they will hold the line. Heck they were part of the group that didn't hold the line the last 2-3 contracts. Do you have confidence in this portion of our group again? Heck these are the same guys who over the past 2 months flew the trips the union encouraged them to take a second look at. Yeh, ive got all the confidence in the world with that group holding the line hahahaha

StarClipper

It’s your choice to support that VB Plan if you want, I’d just like to be give the option to at keep my current plan even if I’m the only one left with it.

NotMrNiceGuy

That 1999 pension adjusted for inflation would be worth $200K if we had upgraded through each contract. Instead, that purchasing power from the 1999 plan has dwindled to just $82K in today’s dollars. Subtract $82K from the $200K and the inability to increase the A-plan has cost nearly $120K. That’s almost the equivalent of the A-plan. At least the VBD outpaces inflation and keeps up with our contractual rate increases above $260,000/year.

StarClipper

Ok let’s say I buy into your VB Plan, and I go out on LTD, how does the VB Plan work for me in that situation?

golfandfly

Yeah.. the new guys are going to hold the line! Right...I’ve voted against the last two contracts and the FDA LOA. Never flown a disputed pairing and never flew draft in negotiations.

I’m blaming the union for the last CBA. They should have never brought it to a vote. Once they did, peak was essentially over. We were extremely overmanned and had some leverage (probably the best we’ll ever have). They said they wouldn’t push approval on the membership, but they did.

Most of us don’t want the VRB. Why don’t they conduct a simple poll, with a yes or no answer? Not a question like, “would you rather keep your pension or have the union try to improve it?” My guess is that the membership would be very much against it.

UPS has managed to get A Fund gains in their last CBA and also in their latest agreement. We’ve got nothing.

And tell me why I want these guys significantly changing my A plan? What could possibly go wrong?

Noworkallplay

UPS only got flat dollar increase for guys retiring under the CBA extension. So no they didn't, they did band aid fix just like we have done.

As for the last contract you are wrong once again. Look at your fellow pilots who were around then. They are the ones who ratified it. Its no different than the next contract. Look at Delta. That group turned down a contract. They then went back and got something better. Stop blaming and lets look our fellow pilots in the eyes and tell them to step up. We may need to have some stern talks with our buddies to wake the heck up. I'm sure you have buddies currently complaining but, yet still operating under what they call unsafe rest facilities and unsafe fatiguing pairings or unsafe none cleaned airplanes. Ask them why they haven't done the safe thing and demand a fix before operating. Stop making excuses and start holding people accountable even if its your bro. If you or any pilot is unwilling to do this then shut the traps and go away sooner than later, we would all appreciate it.

FXLAX

Just to play devil’s advocate, isn’t that full retirement check that is never missed due to that contract that was negotiated by those you don’t trust? In other words, if there was a loophole in that part of the contract, wouldn’t management already exploited it, like they have with first class seats?

golfandfly

Anyone that flies a disputed pairing voluntarily is a douche bag. How many times have you refused a trip for those unsafe conditions? Has every airplane you’ve flown been sanitized? Did you fly? Of course you did. So let’s not hear about how tough you are.

I hoped the union would opt out of the agreement and renegotiate. You know, stop making excuses and step up. People are staying in substandard hotels now. If it’s unsafe, then don’t fly. If you’re ok, then fly. It’s sort of an unusual situation now, don’t you think?

I told you how I voted. And I posted numerous times here that it was a bad deal. But the CBA got a majority, and the union lobbied hard to get a majority. Funny, now it’s hard to find anyone that voted for it.

UPS has made substantial flat dollar pension gains. I could care less if we have to renegotiate. But for our union, it was a line in the sand that just couldn’t be done.

golfandfly

How many stabilized variable plans like this are in existence today? I don’t know of any tailored like this one. I believe MLB has one, but certainly not this complex. Our current A is a typical pension that was fairly common. Obviously not anymore, but they had a lot of examples to go by...

Noworkallplay

And you answered the biggest question of why do we need to look at other formulas. Our current plan is not common anymore bc the rules changed in 2006 Pension Protection Act. Those who didn’t have their pension whipped out by bankruptcy are now left with a pension that is massively expensive and the fundamentals were not built around the new regulations. It’s massively expensive to raise the benefit. You want to fight that fight again and loose be my guest. Oh and guess what no arbitration is ever going to rule in your favor to increase it if it gets to that point. It’s a ticking time bomb about to blow up and leave a bunch of pilots holding the bag going “but they promised me”. Just ask your buddies who lost theirs. Change the equation or loose it bottom line.