FedEx 737s?

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01-12-2021, 04:53 PM

MaydayMark

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FedEx 737s?

OK APCers ... maybe it's obvious (especially to the CGN folks) but while scouring the Internet looking for FDX aircraft pics I stumbled across a "planespotter" website. I was surprised to see FedEx (painted) 737s (seemingly -4XX series and almost exclusively in Germany?).

I don't remember hearing about 737s? are FedEx pilots flying them?

TIA ...

~ MM

https://www.planespotters.net/photo/...eing-737-4q8sf

https://www.planespotters.net/photos...Express?page=8

01-12-2021, 05:04 PM

ItnStln

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It looks like they're operated by ASL Airlines Belgium.

01-12-2021, 05:21 PM

Noworkallplay

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MaydayMark

Dont quote me but I think they are operated intra Europe. Leftover routes from TNT I think. We also have some 75s operated intra Canada by Morningstar. The Canadian flying is country restricted I think.

01-12-2021, 05:30 PM

Thrust Hold

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

Intra Canada is considered Cabotage.

01-13-2021, 07:44 AM

Freighthumper

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

I think your right. All seems to be ASL except Iceland Air who does LGG-KEF.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thrust Hold

Intra Canada is considered Cabotage.

Cabotage as in US based FedEx crews can’t fly it.

Our contract is pretty weak when looking at who can fly our freight overseas.

01-13-2021, 05:23 PM

Noworkallplay

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Freighthumper

I think your right. All seems to be ASL except Iceland Air who does LGG-KEF.

Cabotage as in US based FedEx crews can’t fly it.

Our contract is pretty weak when looking at who can fly our freight overseas.

Im fairly certain case law has stated a US airline union cant set scope for none US flying. PanAm lawsuit comes to mind. You can only scope what leaves or returns from US soil said the courts.

We as FedEx pilots can actually do more than what we allow other countries to do on US soil. For example we can operate intra ASIA or intra Europe but those countries can not operate intra US. I actually think our scope is fairly tight for what we can scope.

01-13-2021, 06:02 PM

tnkrdrvr

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

Im fairly certain case law has stated a US airline union cant set scope for none US flying. PanAm lawsuit comes to mind. You can only scope what leaves or returns from US soil said the courts.
.

This is not correct. IPA won in arbitration for the company (UPS) sub-contracting out our Istanbul-Tel Aviv flying. Cabotage is obviously outside of either company or US court’s control. However, it has not been a significant obstacle for us so far. On another thread someone asked about our intra-Canada flying. I am pretty positive it all flows through one of our US sorts (SDF, RFD, etc). Other than feeder flying (payload capacity below 14,500 lbs), all UPS freight must be flown by IPA members. There certainly are no 75s flying around Canada with our paint and someone else’s flying. There are short term exceptions available for peak and unexpected surges in volume like last spring.

01-13-2021, 06:25 PM

Noworkallplay

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Quote:

Originally Posted by tnkrdrvr

Im not sure of the specifics of the arbitration you are talking about. Arbitration and international courts are two different things. At FedEx we fly all our freight in and out of Canada, however the intra Canada we do not do per cabotage. Im not a lawyer, but sat by some in a previous life and had many discussions on this topic. Each situation is very different with each country and winning an arbitration doesn't mean it will stand up in international courts. I leave that stuff to people way smarter than me and those willing to volunteer. Didn't you guys loose a bunch of India flying due to thinking you could scope it? Im just a lazy line guy so don't know all the details.

01-14-2021, 07:23 AM

Nitefrater

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

We as FedEx pilots can actually do more than what we allow other countries to do on US soil. For example we can operate intra ASIA or intra Europe but those countries can not operate intra US. I actually think our scope is fairly tight for what we can scope.

You're confusing countries with continents. (That's OK, the EU does it all the time). What FedEx does in the markets you reference are covered by the 5th and 7th Freedoms of the Air. The Freedoms are negotiated bilaterally.
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedoms_of_the_air

01-17-2021, 10:45 AM

#10

Noworkallplay

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Nitefrater

Correct. Typo on my behalf.

What many are missing is what routes can be legally flown and whats able to be scoped is two different things. We can fly from A to B but can we write scope that will stand up in court over that route.

Once again PanAm has already tried this and had the courts tell them you have no jurisdiction to set scope language on that flying. Each international route has its legal nuances and what can or cant be done.