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Retro Pay/Signing Bonus...How much is enough?

Old 08-23-2015, 11:15 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by Raptor View Post
It all is speculation until the crew bus driver gives us the scoop.

But, if first year is 9-11%, I don't need to read any further--NO!

I don't want a 6 year "interim" contract rate. We're already at our third year so "missing" two 3% raises and then getting another 3-4% essentially on signing is not remotely close to acceptable. Delta's TA that was voted down was better than these numbers. We deserve industry leading, and not just for 6 months until we are leapfrogged.

If these low ball rumors are true, I hope the MEC does their job and sends it back to the negotiators. I'm not afraid of the what-if when that happens. Leverage is great right now, and peak would be beyond ugly for the company.
I agree ... The first 9-10% is COLA ... After that we actually get a raise.

The 15 year Captain rate needs to be $3xx per hour
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Old 08-23-2015, 08:18 PM
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Not necessarily, mcdbirdman. There is more to a good contract than JUST money.
We'll know soon enough.
Cheers,
fbh
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Old 08-23-2015, 08:27 PM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by frozenboxhauler View Post
Not necessarily, mcdbirdman. There is more to a good contract than JUST money.
We'll know soon enough.
Cheers,
fbh
Yes, necessarily. If the compensation portion is concessionary then you honestly think the remainder of the agreement will make up for it? There is no way. You know better. We all do.

As I have said before, the devil is in the details, but I think we would prefer not to start this process behind the eight ball on pay and work our back into a not just a mediocre contract, but a good one. You are right though, fbh, there is more to a good contract than just the coin.

Last edited by Chainsaw; 08-23-2015 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 08-23-2015, 08:29 PM
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Pay rates and signing bonuses are shiny ornaments meant to elicit the 51%. Keep your eyes on the ball. Work rules, insurance and retirement compensation complete the whole picture.
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Old 08-23-2015, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Chainsaw View Post
Yes, necessarily. If the compensation portion is concessionary then you honestly think the remainder of the agreement will make up for it? There is no way. You know better. We all do.
Chainsaw, gotta look at the big picture here. Firstly, what is your definition of "concessionary"? Do you expect the Company to offer us LESS than we're making now? THAT'S CONCESSIONARY!

I want, (that sounds mean),... I would like a lot more money, both now AND in retirement, better scheduling and work rules and MUCH cleaner contract language, to name a few things and am willing to do whatever I (we) need to do as Union members to get there.
Keep the faith,
fbh
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:09 PM
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Not mean FBH. Only expectations from years of unexpected give-backs via a contract filled with "where feasibles" and "you don't like it, grieve it, seeya at the table in two years".
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by frozenboxhauler View Post
Chainsaw, gotta look at the big picture here. Firstly, what is your definition of "concessionary"? Do you expect the Company to offer us LESS than we're making now? THAT'S CONCESSIONARY! fbh
fbh, I would say that any amount of pay raise that falls below REAL inflationary numbers, (not the fake 3% the government puts out) would be concessionary. I haven't done the research, so I would conservatively estimate the real inflation rate at least twice that at 6%. Now add all the years we didn't get a pay raise plus all the years we are supposed to get one in the future. We are moving back AT LEAST 3% buying power every year, if not more. So in 6 years, I would say you would be down over 20%. Someone on this forum earlier gave the example of a new truck going from 33K in 2008 to 60K in 2015. I guess that is what I would consider concessionary. Just not moving backward every year.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by frozenboxhauler View Post
fbh
fbh, OBTW, I'm not sure I understand your avatar, but I think I like it.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:35 PM
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Chainsaw. would you like a contract where everyone got $500 an hour, but you had to go to FAR limits with no protection, no insurance, no retirement (I think I should call this deferred compensation)? In essence, you're on your own, independent contractor Think it out.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Chainsaw View Post
fbh, OBTW, I'm not sure I understand your avatar, but I think I like it.
Thanks Chain!
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