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TA = Backdoor PBS? You Decide…

Old 10-04-2015, 09:53 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by HercMasterJ View Post
Sections 25.S.2.e/d/f are part of the new efficiencies...prior to this TA, paying 125% discouraged schedulers from these disruptions. Now, at only 1.5-3 Credit hours per disruption, there is nothing to inhibit them from doing so.
Unless the out and back blocks more than 6 hours, a 1.5 hour disruption is 125%.

Currently, the company can revise your single city layover to a different city (i.e. FLL revised to CPR) and not pay you anything extra. They also don't have to put you in sub or offer RAT. So 3 extra credit hours is another win.
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Old 10-04-2015, 09:55 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Pakagecheck View Post
Not sure what you mean? They actually use their vacation instead of selling it back? I don't see that as a problem.
No, I mean the opposite. Instead of expanding one's vacation usage, you can also reduce the vacation days to use zero days. Resulting in using far less vacation, and far more selling it back.
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Old 10-04-2015, 09:56 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Pakagecheck View Post
So, I am better off not having vacation in December and hip pocket 12 days(72 hrs) and play the trump card when I get a VTO line. Christmas off. Perfect
Beats me, I doubt it would work for Christmas. But it is likely to work for a daughter's wedding. I am sure that the company will keep some hammers to beat up on junior schedules. But we asked for more flexibility, more transparency, and more control. I think we got it.
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Old 10-04-2015, 10:02 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by busdriver12 View Post
No, I mean the opposite. Instead of expanding one's vacation usage, you can also reduce the vacation days to use zero days. Resulting in using far less vacation, and far more selling it back.
Vacation buy back is still limited to 40% unless approved by flight management for extenuating circumstances. Not sure how there could be more selling back. The only time one is forced to use vacation is when you bid a vto or reserve right now.
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Old 10-04-2015, 10:08 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by FDXLAG View Post
Beats me, I doubt it would work for Christmas. But it is likely to work for a daughter's wedding. I am sure that the company will keep some hammers to beat up on junior schedules. But we asked for more flexibility, more transparency, and more control. I think we got it.
I don't see any limitations to using vacation when you don't have it scheduled, only when you add "extended" days. I get if I add 6 days they can still give me a trip over the holidays but if I use an entire month of vacation, I should get the entire month off.

I agree that there is the possibility for more flexibility, I could also see every vto line in december work over christmas with trips or rdays, no matter how senior you are(unless you have an entire month of vacation to play)
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Old 10-04-2015, 11:06 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by Pakagecheck View Post
Vacation buy back is still limited to 40% unless approved by flight management for extenuating circumstances. Not sure how there could be more selling back. The only time one is forced to use vacation is when you bid a vto or reserve right now.
I agree the limitation is still in there, however I think a lot of people do not sell back much (if any) of their vacation. If you are a VTO holder all year, you use 100% of your vacation, with zero sellback. This provision means you could reduce your usage to 60%. I know people will like the flexibility, however, as a matter of principle, I'm not thrilled by anything that encourages people to sell back their vacation.

In addition, it will certainly reduce the number of good trips available for lower numbered VTO holders, if the senior VTO holders reduce their vacation to zero days.
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Old 10-04-2015, 11:15 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by busdriver12 View Post
I agree the limitation is still in there, however I think a lot of people do not sell back much (if any) of their vacation. If you are a VTO holder all year, you use 100% of your vacation, with zero sellback.

In addition, it will certainly reduce the number of good trips available for lower numbered VTO holders, if the senior VTO holders reduce their vacation to zero days.
While I wish your sellback observation was true, I don't think it is. I due think that it is a very small number of the crew force that bids vto all year on purpose and still wants to sell back vacation. I do see your concern but I guess I don't see the numbers changing much. Those that want to sell back vacation tend to find a way.
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Old 10-04-2015, 11:21 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Pakagecheck View Post
While I wish your sellback observation was true, I don't think it is. I due think that it is a very small number of the crew force that bids vto all year on purpose and still wants to sell back vacation. I do see your concern but I guess I don't see the numbers changing much. Those that want to sell back vacation tend to find a way.
Maybe so. Perhaps I'm assuming because I generally go in the hole, that other people do too.

And I have to admit, I'm always happy when VTO holders above me have vacation, as it knocks them out for some of the good trips I'm hoping for, and wouldn't have a shot at otherwise. After this TA, who knows?
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Old 10-04-2015, 11:00 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by FDXLAG View Post

... I doubt it would work for Christmas. But it is likely to work for a daughter's wedding.

Originally Posted by FDXLAG View Post

I welcome more VTOs. I think they will become very popular. Need 1 June off next year but couldnt hold it in the vacation bid, bid a VTO and use vacation.

I hope you'll let your daughter down easy. This provision of the TA doesn't have an implementation date. (Implementations LOA & Appendix on Page 607, Item #123 -- Phase: TBD) It might not be here by June 1, 2016.

Even if it does, there's no guarantee you'll get the vacation you want. §25.E.6.b. "The Company shall:
ii. "Comply with each request given staffing in each crew position, which shall be processed in seniority order within the request type ..."
What makes you think you can elude the almighty, "DENIED - INSUFFICIENT RESERVES"? Good luck with that.






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Old 10-05-2015, 03:22 AM
  #30  
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So until then VTOs are no better and no worse if we vote yes or no? And whatever comes out of the SLRWG will have to be approved by the union. Good recap than.
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