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What is reasonable?
I have been supporting my husband as he's been training with a flight school (not at a 141, just a little independent school at an FBO), but I'm running out of steam. We have two small children and it's getting harder and harder to keep up with all of the bills on my own. I am self-employed and I am stressed and stretched to my limits.
He just passed his instrument check ride two weeks ago. He has 200 flight hours currently. Realistically, how long should it take him to get to 250 and get his commercial rating? He is not working at all, so flying is his full time focus, but it seems go to so much slower than I can stand. He quit working last October and just got his IFR in mid-April. He already had his private and about 100 hours before he quit. Does this seem reasonable? 6 months from 100 hours to IFR? I thought that would go much (much) faster. He says I'm being unreasonable. I say he could be going faster to get me out of this stress-hell and he's not trying hard enough. I completely acknowledge that he could be right. Maybe I am being unreasonable. I'd like him to finish commercial in the next 4-6 weeks. Is that crazy? :confused: Please help me understand what would be a realistic goal. We're really cracking under this pressure. I just need to see the light at the end of this tunnel and to understand how much longer I need to hold this together on my own. |
Depends on the weather. Where I live, most days we still cannot fly due to icing concerns. I used to live in California, and I was able to build 200ish hours in about 4 months.
The stress is understandable but as pilots it's really important that we don't allow external pressures to force us to fly. I'm not sure what your financial situation is but if he finds someone to split time with him it would lessen the burden by a substantial amount Doing a commercial in 4-6 weeks is completely doable, but it's important to note that your husband won't really be employable unless he gets his instructor certificate, hits 500 hours, or gets an aerial survey job (which probably won't happen since he would then be gone for many months) |
Maybe he needs at least a part time, paying job? Age? Any college could factor in. The military reserves may take him, some pay, but he’d also be away some.
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We live in Florida, so there's been no real weather issues since he quit his job in October (just some cancellations for low clouds and wind, as to be expected). The rainy season will start in June though and then we'll have more of a weather problem, but he has 200 hours, so only needs 50 more hours at this point (plus study time to pass the exams).
When you built the 200 hours in 4 months, were you working at all? Or just flying full-time? |
Originally Posted by sourdough44
(Post 2811188)
Maybe he needs at least a part time, paying job? Age? Any college could factor in. The military reserves may take him, some pay, but he’d also be away some.
He's 35, has a four year degree and a sales background. We're not tempted by military since we are SO close. (And kinda old. Ha.) |
I gotta give him(and you) credit for the 30+ y/o career change. I do think he could do something that would pay while not slowing his training down.
Yeah, at that age I’d forget most military options. All the best with the transition. |
Originally Posted by sourdough44
(Post 2811200)
I gotta give him(and you) credit for the 30+ y/o career change. I do think he could do something that would pay while not slowing his training down.
Yeah, at that age I’d forget most military options. All the best with the transition. It's definitely not been the easiest thing we've ever done. |
I wouldn't quit working to learn to fly; it can be done after hours and on the weekends.
Tell him to get back to work. |
This could end badly if things don’t change. I applaud you for supporting your man, this is a tremendous act in and of itself. However, your man has to understand that his priorities, in order of importance are:
#1 Supporting you and the kids (family comes first) #2 Pursuing his career goals If this situation is causing financial stress, time to make a change. He needs to contribute financially. |
So in 6 months your husband has flown 100 hours and only got his instrument rating?
That's slow. Very slow. You can go from 0 to all ratings you need and 500 hours in 6 months. I flew 400 hours in 6 months when going for my career change (same age etc as your husband). Is your budget limiting the hours he is flying? You do realize he won't get a job at 250 hours with just his commercial? He'll either need to build a few hundred hours more to get up to 135 VFR PIC minimums, get his CFI, or get extremely lucky. |
Originally Posted by dera
(Post 2811263)
So in 6 months your husband has flown 100 hours and only got his instrument rating?
That's slow. Very slow. You can go from 0 to all ratings you need and 500 hours in 6 months. I flew 400 hours in 6 months when going for my career change (same age etc as your husband). Is your budget limiting the hours he is flying? You do realize he won't get a job at 250 hours with just his commercial? He'll either need to build a few hundred hours more to get up to 135 VFR PIC minimums, get his CFI, or get extremely lucky. However, he definitely runs into scheduling issues. His flight school needs more planes. They book up fast (as do the instructors), but I feel he could get around this and he hasn't. (He needs to book more flights per week and book them further out in advance.) One example is, right after he passed his instrument, he didn't have any time on a plane for almost two weeks! I'd asked him to book time out for after the checkride, but he said he needed to pass the IFR checkride first and then he'd book time for commercial training, but he couldn't do it beforehand, or it, didn't make sense to, or it just "isn't how it's done." I'm pretty sure he could have booked it in advance, but it's hard for me to argue with him because he just says that I don't know what I'm talking about... which is true. I don't. So, that's why I'm poking around here asking questions. :/ As far as the job at 250 hours, we're planning on selling his soul to one of the little charters that hire at 250 (with a 2 year contract). I know those can be controversial and the pay is crap (but hey, we can only go up from $0), but I truly cannot imagine the stress of trying to also carry him through a CFI rating after the struggle it's been to get through commercial in any sort of timely manner. I just can't. I also don't think he'd be good at managing his schedule, or managing the schedules of students as a CFI. He needs a boss telling him when and where to be. He's a good worker and he's a good pilot. He's gotten high scores and praise on his tests/checkrides so far and from his instructors. But he's just not excelling at this self-directed schooling model and I am terrible at standing by and signing checks while feeling like I would do this all so differently (and much quicker). |
The idea is fine. The execution is terrible. It’s sort of a queuing problem. He needs to schedule like they do in the military, PLAN AHEAD OF TIME and OVERSCHEDULE to offset weather cancels, instructor and aircraft availability issues, etc.
He needs to schedule to task, NOT just look to the next lesson. But whether he will except that advice coming from you - that I don’t know. All you can do is to tell him that if he doesn’t do this EFFICIENTLY, he’s losing substantial time which assuming he does someday fly wide body for a major may be as much as $40K a MONTH at retirement. He’s also burning you out and imperiling the family finances. If he needs to go to a bigger school with more aircraft and instructors and better sche$uling availability, he needs to do it. Get that commercial license and then GET A JOB. And until he does, even working nights at McDonalds would help. |
Originally Posted by ofthesea
(Post 2811284)
No, it's not budget related. The flying money is coming from the sale of a property we owned, so that money is there for his use. It's the money to live off of that is of short supply.
However, he definitely runs into scheduling issues. His flight school needs more planes. They book up fast (as do the instructors), but I feel he could get around this and he hasn't. (He needs to book more flights per week and book them further out in advance.) One example is, right after he passed his instrument, he didn't have any time on a plane for almost two weeks! I'd asked him to book time out for after the checkride, but he said he needed to pass the IFR checkride first and then he'd book time for commercial training, but he couldn't do it beforehand, or it, didn't make sense to, or it just "isn't how it's done." I'm pretty sure he could have booked it in advance, but it's hard for me to argue with him because he just says that I don't know what I'm talking about... which is true. I don't. So, that's why I'm poking around here asking questions. :/ As far as the job at 250 hours, we're planning on selling his soul to one of the little charters that hire at 250 (with a 2 year contract). I know those can be controversial and the pay is crap (but hey, we can only go up from $0), but I truly cannot imagine the stress of trying to also carry him through a CFI rating after the struggle it's been to get through commercial in any sort of timely manner. I just can't. I also don't think he'd be good at managing his schedule, or managing the schedules of students as a CFI. He needs a boss telling him when and where to be. He's a good worker and he's a good pilot. He's gotten high scores and praise on his tests/checkrides so far and from his instructors. But he's just not excelling at this self-directed schooling model and I am terrible at standing by and signing checks while feeling like I would do this all so differently (and much quicker). |
You are one in a million, I'm surprised you have lasted as long as you have. You seem to have a grip on the sked problems. Best of luck, not an easy proposition.
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Lessons that say Night must be done at night. Lessons that don't say night don't HAVE to be done during the day. I did a lot of my instrument rating at night, because it was easier to schedule the plane. For the commercial, it's harder to schedule that way. The maneuvers pretty much need to be done during the day. The cross country flights could probably be done at night, even though they don't specify night. If there's issues scheduling the plane, see if they'll let him fly before or after business hours. When I was an instructor I had a key to the place. I had one guy that wanted to fly at 5am, we never had scheduling issues.
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A south Florida 135 operator, what could possibly go wrong?
GF |
Originally Posted by dera
(Post 2811263)
So in 6 months your husband has flown 100 hours and only got his instrument rating?
That's slow. Very slow. You can go from 0 to all ratings you need and 500 hours in 6 months. I flew 400 hours in 6 months when going for my career change (same age etc as your husband). Is your budget limiting the hours he is flying? You do realize he won't get a job at 250 hours with just his commercial? He'll either need to build a few hundred hours more to get up to 135 VFR PIC minimums, get his CFI, or get extremely lucky. But for the wife, you do need to give him space prior to checkrides, he needs to be fully focused on that. The career ramifications of failed checkrides are significant and will follow you forever. |
I think you’re asking reasonable questions. It’s one thing to quit your job and go to an accelerated course, flying every day. But flying now and then and taking two weeks off? He probably ought to get a job delivering pizzas at night or something at least.
For you though, try to take the long view when you get frustrated, the potential pay off is pretty good. Getting there is painful and requires sacrifice (as you are learning). I highly recommend he go straight to CFI, that’s going to be the quickest way to a paying flying job and eventual airline job. With what I’m hearing, I’m concerned about his inertia. I could see him struggling to find a non CFI job for several months (and he definitely needs a non flying job in the interim). |
If he has the time, money, and dedication he should’ve just gone to ATP. They’re all over Florida. He could finish all his ratings through MEI in six months given he also has the aptitude.
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Originally Posted by Myfingershurt
(Post 2811557)
If he has the time, money, and dedication he should’ve just gone to ATP. They’re all over Florida. He could finish all his ratings through MEI in six months given he also has the aptitude.
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Thanks for all the insight.
You all gave me enough confidence to insist he can finish this last bit up while having a part time job. Hopefully he follows through and hopefully we're looking back at all of this a year or two from now and it's in the rear-view mirror. I know there are new challenges to come, but this season as been particularly tough. |
Originally Posted by ofthesea
(Post 2811190)
We live in Florida, so there's been no real weather issues since he quit his job in October (just some cancellations for low clouds and wind, as to be expected). The rainy season will start in June though and then we'll have more of a weather problem, but he has 200 hours, so only needs 50 more hours at this point (plus study time to pass the exams).
When you built the 200 hours in 4 months, were you working at all? Or just flying full-time? |
Originally Posted by TheWeatherman
(Post 2812931)
That's not how it works, you do not just get handed a commercial certificate by having 250 hours and passing the written. He will need to perform the training requirements of the commercial certificate and be proficient enough in the maneuvers to have a CFI sign him off for the practical. Depending on the training he has had so far through 200 hours, it could take him significantly more then 250 hours.
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Originally Posted by TheWeatherman
(Post 2812931)
That's not how it works, you do not just get handed a commercial certificate by having 250 hours and passing the written. He will need to perform the training requirements of the commercial certificate and be proficient enough in the maneuvers to have a CFI sign him off for the practical. Depending on the training he has had so far through 200 hours, it could take him significantly more then 250 hours.
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Originally Posted by kettlechips
(Post 2813006)
If he budgets out like 20 hours for training then I think he should be alright
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Originally Posted by ofthesea
(Post 2813011)
He has already started the commercial training. It look months(!) to get scheduled with a DPE for his IFR, so in the meantime, he started commercial training even before he passed IFR. I know he wouldn’t be ready for the commercial check ride tomorrow, but feel pretty confident he’ll be ready at or around 250 hours.
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