good or bad deal...?
 

ok guys I need your opinions.

here is the deal. my instructor has me and this other kid finishing up our PPL's on the same day (next saturday). so he told me today that if I let this other kid fly safety pilot with me for about 100 hours (time building for commercial) in my plane (and for those of you who dont know or dont remember I pay $15/hour plus fuel, which is around $3.75 here. so, wet, my plane runs about $45/hour), then he'll give me my instrument and commercial training for free.

so i guess my question is, is this a good deal? or should I just find someone else to split the plane/fuel costs straight down the middle and pay for the instruction separately?

Safety pilot time is not the greatest way to build commercial time, but I suppose it is technically legal. If the OTHER guy asked the question I would tell him not to use safety pilot time towards HIS commercial.

But it sounds like you'll be the hood pilot, not the safety pilot? If so, I suppose there's nothing wrong with hood time towards commercial (as long as your required VFR commercial X-countries are not done under the hood). Doesn't sound like too bad a deal to me, but get it in writing from the school or FBO...if that CFI gets an airline job, who's going to provide your free training?

it would be half and half stuff... like fly a 4 hour trip, first 2 hours I would be under the foggles and the last 2 hours he would be under the foggles... just taking turns between the seats.

and as far as my instructor goes, he's legit. he is just an indepentant CFI who is a college professor with 3500+ dual given. he has no intentions of going to the airlines. plus, its all pay as you go. if he decided he doesn't want to give me free instruction anymore, i just don't take that other kid along with me.

I had the same deal as a student, but fuel was a bit cheaper 5 years ago so my plane was running about $35/hour. The CFI was willing to work for free to get the time as the airport was a bit out of the way and students were a bit rare. The result was substandard training and during the summer when he had enough students to keep busy it was difficult for me to get enough time to make progress. I would find a good instructor and pay them well for their work. You will actually need the knowledge. 121 training is difficult enough without making it harder on yourself by not having a good base of knowledge to work from. Just my 2 cents; paying good money is well worth it.:)

money is expensive tho :p

anymore ideas anyone?

I've heard of some places not looking too highly on saftey pilot time....for example, SKYW.

However, in the grand scheme of things, 100 hours isn't a big deal. How much would the instruction cost, vs. the amount you will spend to operate the a/c ? Whats your instructors hourly rate?, and how close are you to being finished up?

I'm sorry, I just re-read your post. It doesn't sound like a bad deal...you will need the time for your commercial anyway, If it runs you about $4500 to operate the a/c for 100 hours, how much would the instruction cost you for your instrument and commercial?

I don't get what in if for him that he's willing to instruct you for free?

Sounds like something I'd consider unethical is going on, though, you have to consider I think the whole safety pilot thing is unethical in the first place.

But if you made a deal with the kid for some safety pilot time, how does that benefit the CFI? Somethings fishy in Denmark.

I'm kinda wondering about the other student too. Most people rent an airplane on their own and fly around when they're learning Part 61. After all, you'd need 250 total, but can learn the Commercial maneuvers in less than 20 hours.

the other kid payed him a lump sum of like $16k to get him from 0 to commercial. so my instructor "actually plays for the plane"... so if the kid flies with me, he doesn't have to shell out the money for the plane and just gives his time up to me to instruct. make sense? he can make due either way, but this way i guess he is trying to save us both money.

and rat, thats what i was trying to figure out... $4500 for 100 hours, but I don't know how many hours of instruction are usually needed for instrument and commercial. i have 0 hours so far between the two, as I just finished up my private. His hourly rate is $26/hour or $21/hour if you pay him in advance (like that other kid did)...

i hope this makes some sense. lol

In my opinion, your CFI buddy is doing something unethical. Having the guy "fly with you" means a bunch of safety pilot time. Very little of this sort of time is beneficial, I think. To ask you to accept such a deal to benefit himself doesn't sound too good.

you're right i guess, but we were going to do the safety pilot thing before he even mentioned the deal in the first place... and i know safety pilot time is not the greatest as far as specific requirements go, but it shouldn't be too bad for TT should it?

like im reading the commercial requirements now... it says that you need 250 TT, and 100 need to be PIC.. i wouldn't expect to count the safety time towards PIC(or cross country or anything else specific for that matter), but I wouldn't think it would matter towards TT.

At this point (unless you are learning in a plane you aren't rated for) any time in your total is going to be PIC. The only difference would be if you were getting your Multi. The training time is not PIC since you don't have that rating. The only exception would be an aircraft that requires 2 pilots. I don't think there are any singles that qualify.

yeah i realize that.. but im saying for the actual PIC requirement (being 100) I would only count ACTUAL PIC vs. safety pilot PIC... regardless if i had 300 PIC time (including safety pilot PIC), i'd keep building it until i had 100 actual PIC...