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LongRoadAhead 02-24-2020 11:40 AM

Advice for Instrument Training
 
I believe it's been posted before but here goes. I started instrument training last week, I currently have about 5hrs. In the Redbird and 5 hrs. in a C-172P(I started training with about 115 TT). I knocked out my ground school and written prior to starting needless to say I feel like a complete moron. I feel like I understand the conceptual side of instrument flying but as soon as I put the foggles on my brain goes into vapor lock. I have shot a couple of ILS approaches, a few RNAV approaches, and a few VOR approaches. Needless to say the VOR's have by far been the worst , especially the holds. I find the hardest part has been visualizing my position in space in relation to a VOR, especially when executing a hold. For what it's worth I'm flying a Garmin 430W with an HSI. Just wondering if any experienced aviators on here had some advice. Thanks again fly safe.

rickair7777 02-24-2020 11:58 AM

1. Your instructor is a moron, you're missing foundational stuff.
2. You need more time on the basics in the FTD before doing approaches (or anything) in an airplane. At this point you should be mastering BAI, simple ATC tasks, turning, climb, descent, level off. Only when you have that cold move on to nav tasks in approximately this order: Radial intercept/tracking, straight-in ILS, holds, straight-in non-prec approaches, PTs, full approaches, RNAV approaches.
3. Do a LOT of chair-flying holds and PT's. You can do that with pencil and paper.
4. Memorize the compass rose in increments of ten, including reciprocals.

Trying to do advanced tasks (especially in the airplane) before you have the basics mastered will be frustrating and probably lead to bad habits. For holds and PT's you have to think in terms of radials... you can do it, just need to get really immersed in radials, recips, and 30/45 degree intercepts (I like 30 cuz the math is easier).

If you're not rock solid on something in the FTD, no point in trying it in the plane.

TiredSoul 02-24-2020 04:32 PM

First of all you shouldn’t be doing any of that stuff.
First 10-15 hrs is fundamental Basic Attitude Instrument Flying.
What syllabus are you using if any?
A sim or FTD is great for the basic stuff.
If you don’t know the basics you’ll never fly a decent ILS approach as you don’t learn to fly approaches by flying approaches.
You learn to fly approaches by practicing the basics.
And for the love of everything holy....you don’t “shoot” an approach you FLY an approach.
Pet peeve.

cons 02-24-2020 04:33 PM

Work on improving your instrument scan in the cockpit. It seems as though your CFII is putting the cart before the the horse. You should not be shooting approaches and entering holds if you don't have the basics down. BAI flying, constant airspeed climbs, constant airspeed descents, constant rate climbs, constant rate descents, standard rate turns, climbing and descending turns, all these should be done prior to starting approaches and holds. Approaches and holds should be gone over on the ground after the above has been done. Visualizing where you are reference the VOR is critical in how you will enfer the hold and where the radial for the hold is.

JamesNoBrakes 02-24-2020 08:31 PM

There are instrument rules of thumb you apply to everything, intercepts, attitude changes, constant rate turns, etc. If your instructor is not teaching these, you are missing out.

galaxy flyer 02-25-2020 04:00 PM

Ask your instructor about the applications for the 1:60 rule. Then ask about how to use true and ground speed to determine turn radius or wind. If you get a blank stare, find another instructor.

TiredSoul 02-25-2020 05:25 PM


Originally Posted by galaxy flyer (Post 2984046)
Ask your instructor about the applications for the 1:60 rule. Then ask about how to use true and ground speed to determine turn radius or wind. If you get a blank stare, find another instructor.

Honestly none of this is even applicable at this stage in (his) training.

JamesNoBrakes 02-25-2020 07:48 PM


Originally Posted by TiredSoul (Post 2984110)
Honestly none of this is even applicable at this stage in (his) training.

Yes, more basic stuff like the bank angle formula for standard rate turn, how to roll out on mag compass headings, when to start a turn for a 90 degree course change, how many degrees of pitch for 100fpm, how many RPMs/MP for 5kts, etc...

TiredSoul 02-25-2020 09:45 PM

And all of this is what you use an FTD or Simulator trainer for.

galaxy flyer 02-26-2020 05:53 AM


Originally Posted by TiredSoul (Post 2984110)
Honestly none of this is even applicable at this stage in (his) training.

True, but his instructor should know for later.


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