Shooting a Pilot Nav (as published) approach question
09-15-2007, 08:31 PM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: Cessna 150 Left seat
Posts: 430
Shooting a Pilot Nav (as published) approach question
When you are shooting a LOC approach Pilot Nav and say the Final Approach Course is 180, I would go out on a course reversal for two minutes once I pass the IAF(NDB in this case) and do the prcedure turn inbound to intercept the Localizer.
So my question is, when I'm going out bound for 2 minutes on Final approach course, am I tracking the localizer out bound or am I just flying the heading... in this case 360 for two minutes?
I guess the same goes for VOR approach. If I tracking out bound on a final aproch course of 181(radial), am I just heading a 360 for two minutes or am I suppose to actually track 181 radial out bound?
thanks!!!
So my question is, when I'm going out bound for 2 minutes on Final approach course, am I tracking the localizer out bound or am I just flying the heading... in this case 360 for two minutes?
I guess the same goes for VOR approach. If I tracking out bound on a final aproch course of 181(radial), am I just heading a 360 for two minutes or am I suppose to actually track 181 radial out bound?
thanks!!!
09-15-2007, 09:01 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: Retired
Posts: 2,934
You fly outbound on the radial. Do this for a couple reasons. First, the protected airspace and terrain clearance is predicated on the final approach course. Second, by flying outbound on the course you have a good idea of the required wind correction and you aren't going to be flying "blindly" and wondering when the needle is going to center on the PT.
09-15-2007, 09:09 PM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: Cessna 150 Left seat
Posts: 430
Originally Posted by Pilotpip
You fly outbound on the radial. Do this for a couple reasons. First, the protected airspace and terrain clearance is predicated on the final approach course. Second, by flying outbound on the course you have a good idea of the required wind correction and you aren't going to be flying "blindly" and wondering when the needle is going to center on the PT.
Is this just recommended or is this madatory? I ask this becuase You are still at pretty high altitude in most case...somtimes even at or above Minimum Safe Altitude if I'm not mistaken.
09-16-2007, 04:29 PM
#6
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,211
Originally Posted by SongMan
How about Localizer? Do I have to track Localizer outbound too?
Is this just recommended or is this madatory? I ask this becuase You are still at pretty high altitude in most case...somtimes even at or above Minimum Safe Altitude if I'm not mistaken.
Is this just recommended or is this madatory? I ask this becuase You are still at pretty high altitude in most case...somtimes even at or above Minimum Safe Altitude if I'm not mistaken.
09-16-2007, 05:26 PM
#7
APC co-founder
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: B777
Posts: 5,853
Time, Speed, and Distance.......
Why 2 minutes, why not 2:10 or 1:50?
My point being is that the time you chose to fly outbound SHOULD have a direct correlation ground speed. If flying a course reversal (full procedure turn) TERPS defines protected airspace as 10NM outbound from the fix, 6NM on the PT side and 2NM on the non-PT side of the outbound course.
Any timing should be predicated on the GROUNDSPEED at which the reversal is flown as to stay within the protected airspace defined by TERPS.
Not to nit-pick, but, flying 1 minute or 2 minutes "just because" isn't correct and it may not keep you within protected airspace.
My point being is that the time you chose to fly outbound SHOULD have a direct correlation ground speed. If flying a course reversal (full procedure turn) TERPS defines protected airspace as 10NM outbound from the fix, 6NM on the PT side and 2NM on the non-PT side of the outbound course.
Any timing should be predicated on the GROUNDSPEED at which the reversal is flown as to stay within the protected airspace defined by TERPS.
Not to nit-pick, but, flying 1 minute or 2 minutes "just because" isn't correct and it may not keep you within protected airspace.
09-16-2007, 05:34 PM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: Retired
Posts: 2,934
As HSLD said, the important thing isn't flying exactly 2 minutes every time. The only thing you should do is complete the turn within 10nm of the fix and give yourself enough time to be established, configured and stabilized. If you have a strong headwind while flying outbound you may want to extend to 3 or 4 minutes to allow for this.
09-16-2007, 07:48 PM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: JS32 FO
Posts: 848
You're right. You are required to stay within 10 miles of the IAF. In the light airplanes we usually fly, 2 minutes will usually keep you with in the area, but for an off-field IAF it will take forever to get back to the airport.
09-18-2007, 08:07 AM
#10
APC co-founder
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: B777
Posts: 5,853
Originally Posted by the King
You're right. You are required to stay within 10 miles of the IAF. In the light airplanes we usually fly, 2 minutes will usually keep you with in the area, but for an off-field IAF it will take forever to get back to the airport.
My only point was that knowing the impact wind is having on groundspeed/ground track, you'll be better equipped to adjust timed turns. As you can tell I'm not a fan of the one size fits all "2 minute" rule.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Lbell911
Regional
23
04-22-2012 10:33 AM
