Difficult student and checkride busts
 

Fellow flight instructors:

I am in search of a little advice...and please no peanut gallery...I would like to keep this constructive.

Situation: I inherited a private student from another flight instructor at my flight school earlier this year. He had one bust on his oral and then one on his practical flight. The flight seemed to go so so from what I was told, except the examiner did not think he was the most coordinated pilot. Not to mention he got a little lost on his xc. Granted he says he was in very "hazy" conditions.

I took over his training and discovered that he had more wrong with his flying than just that. I informed him that it was in his best interest for me to fix a lot of these areas of his flying so that he could be a safer pilot. He has been a very dedicated student but when I was finally confident to sign him for his practical, he did fine on the oral but once again pulled off a few mistakes on the flight. This is not my first ppl sign off by a long shot and I have never seen anyone mess up more on a checkride than this guy.

Fast forward a few weeks and I find myself wondering a few things, how will I sign him off again? If he isn't ready for the checkride again, how can I do that to not only him, but myself. I don't want to take the hit on my ticket again, and on top of it...at what point does the FAA say that they will not issue him a license?

If he messes up again will that be another hit on my ticket? And if he busts again, would you sign him off after a second bust? It is a tough call because he has a lot of money sunk into the training, and he is very dedicated. I just feel that he freezes when he gets in front of this examiner. I feel very loyal to him for his business but at what point is enough?

Just wondering if anyone here has seen or had this type of student. I have tried everything I can think of....and as a CFI with over 1500 hrs of dual given...I am scratching my head! Thanks!

Tough situation.

If he busts again you might be in for some FSDO scrutiny. This would depend largely on the DPE...he would probably have to flag the situation to the feds, assuming that your record is decent so far. You don't want to be the guy with multiple students who have multiple busts.

If the student does not demonstrate consistent performance (two consecutive mock checkrides to PTS standards) I would not sign him off again. It's possible that he can do OK with you, but choke on game day...that's a tough call. Technically you can sign him off based on his demonstrated ability to meet the standards even if you suspect he might fold under pressure. But obviously that's not good for anyone involved.

I would talk to the DPE, since any trouble which comes out of this will start with him.

Also be sure and have another CFI do a mock checkride with the guy...preferably a stranger.

Thanks Rick...he will for sure go to a mock checkride...I think I should open a dialogue with the DPE because I don't need that on my record. I know it does look better to fix him and get him passed rather than walk away from the situation all together.

I don't have any CFI (PPL) experience, but I've trained a lot and given a lot of checkrides and I'll bet that this is the key to that students success - especially if he flies to standards with his past instructor and now you.
He gets comfortable with his regular guy, knows what he likes and how he runs things, and then has a brain dump when it comes to flying with someone new - much less on a ACTUAL checkride.
I kow it will be more money for this person, but if explain what you think the problem might be (and especially if he agrees with you), then I'm sure that once you have seen him perform to standards that at a minimum TWO different mock checks with TWO different mock DPEs (assuming he passes and then having that one-on-one with the actual DPE) should go a long ways to settling down the butterflies.

USMCFLYR

Have you spoken directly and candidly with the DPE? These guys will generally have a lot of insight and can at least give you their opinion (FWIW) on what went wrong and why. Is is a basic skill problem? Is is too much focus or too little? Is it checkride-itis that can be overcome? Is it....?

Definately go with the DPE and get some side-information on the situation. Some people just have a hard time with testing, but once let out on their own they are fine.

Let me guess Leslie did his ride right? LOL have Jim or Keith fly with him and see how it goes.

Woa...how did you know? Yeah...that is exactly what I am going to do. I talked to her and she said the same thing. I have tried everything I know, and I think getting him out of his comfort zone is going to be the only way he will do better. I have to look at it this way...he can continue to struggle and learn from it, or he can get signed off, have a good day, and then the next bad day he has is with his family and something bad happens. I need to make sure that he is safe. Right now there are doubts and thats not good for either parties. I can't afford to be wrong in this situation.

Leslie is a beast literally. She busted me on a bogus oral question.

What was the question?

-mini