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-   -   Logging time in right seat (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/flight-schools-training/5482-logging-time-right-seat.html)

TravisUK 08-22-2006 01:27 PM

Logging time in right seat
 
A little confused on how the regulations go as far as this is concerned. I have my PPL and I have been offered to fly in the right seat in a King Air C90. Can i log that time as anything? I am thinking no since it is multi and I don't have that am i correct?

Travis

KZ1000Shaft 08-22-2006 01:47 PM

The only time you will be able to log time in a C90 with a PPL SEL is if the other guy is giving you instruction. And then it would be "dual received" no PIC or SIC.

rickair7777 08-22-2006 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KZ1000Shaft (Post 54797)
The only time you will be able to log time in a C90 with a PPL SEL is if the other guy is giving you instruction. And then it would be "dual received" no PIC or SIC.

And even that could get you in trouble if the airplane does not have full dual instruments...the student usually sits in the left seat, not the right so that would be fishy.

flynavyj 08-22-2006 04:20 PM

wouldn't be overly "fishy" , dual controls would be what...yoke and rudders? got both of those in a C90. If the guy is willing to give you some dual given in the C90 it wouldn't be a bad idea, also, it'll help you start building the multi time that you're going to need when you go to get a job later in life. Even if you can't log it, it'll be some good experience for you flying something that's pretty quick and turbine powered, several flights in it, and the systmes should start making a little sense.

rickair7777 08-22-2006 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flynavyj (Post 54838)
wouldn't be overly "fishy" , dual controls would be what...yoke and rudders? got both of those in a C90. If the guy is willing to give you some dual given in the C90 it wouldn't be a bad idea, also, it'll help you start building the multi time that you're going to need when you go to get a job later in life. Even if you can't log it, it'll be some good experience for you flying something that's pretty quick and turbine powered, several flights in it, and the systmes should start making a little sense.


Of course it has dual controls, but it also needs dual instruments...logging student time without flight instruments in front of your face would probably not fly with the fed...

FlyerJosh 08-22-2006 05:43 PM

Major flight schools such as ATP and American Flyers do it all the time. Many pilot training programs teach commercial maneuvers from the right seat so that a student can take a CFI practical right after getting their commercial certificate. No instruments over there...

Unless there's a specific regulation prohibiting it, I would say it's legal, provided that the PIC is appropriately rated to provide instruction in the given aircraft (IE either MEI or if an appropriate aircraft an ATP certificate.)

That said, it might raise some questions as to legitimacy in an interview down the road (if a career in aviation is your ultimate goal, that is... It's kind of odd to see a private pilot with multi-turbine time...)

rickair7777 08-22-2006 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyerJosh (Post 54861)
That said, it might raise some questions as to legitimacy in an interview down the road (if a career in aviation is your ultimate goal, that is... It's kind of odd to see a private pilot with multi-turbine time...)


I used to work at AF, that is correct, but those were commercial students who were obviously working toward their CFI...it is realistic and believable.

A private pilot logging dual in the right seat of a twin-turbine aircraft is not realistic or credible...ESPECIALLY if it's XC country time :rolleyes:

The FAA has demonstrated that it does not allow blanket logging of dual just because a CFI is present...they actually want legitimate training to be involved.

FlyerJosh 08-22-2006 06:52 PM

One issue that does come into play is the question of "for hire". Since the FAA has ruled that flight time is a form of "compensation" there is definately grey area if you are just logging time for the purpose of logging time. Particularly as a private pilot. If you can show that you are conducting legitimate training with the end goal of taking a multi-engine checkride (presumably in that particular type of aircraft), then I'd say go for it. (Including the XC time).

However if the person you're flying with doesn't have an MEI or would be willing to let you fly from the left seat from time to time, I'd probably pass up the opportunity of logging the time.

Either way, be sure to take them up on the opportunity as a learning experience. There's definately no regulation that says you can't fly along and enjoy the ride (as well as put some systems and procedures knowledge into your grey matter.)

Ottopilot 08-22-2006 07:19 PM

The answer, like most have said, is no. But, I did log some time in a Cheyenne 400LS as SIC. It is a "single pilot" airplane. I logged it because I was trained in it and took a FAA 135 checkride in it to be SIC. We operated it as a two pilot airplane. Remember that I was an ATP and took a FAA part 135 SIC checkride in it. That was good enough for me to log it as SIC.

Joshrk22 08-22-2006 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyerJosh (Post 54878)
One issue that does come into play is the question of "for hire". Since the FAA has ruled that flight time is a form of "compensation" there is definately grey area if you are just logging time for the purpose of logging time. Particularly as a private pilot. If you can show that you are conducting legitimate training with the end goal of taking a multi-engine checkride (presumably in that particular type of aircraft), then I'd say go for it. (Including the XC time).

However if the person you're flying with doesn't have an MEI or would be willing to let you fly from the left seat from time to time, I'd probably pass up the opportunity of logging the time.

Either way, be sure to take them up on the opportunity as a learning experience. There's definately no regulation that says you can't fly along and enjoy the ride (as well as put some systems and procedures knowledge into your grey matter.)

So when I get my PPL and go to the local airport to offer to fly along AND log the time, I can't do that?


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