Is the $200k Debt worth it?
 

Hello guys, I am new to the forums. I am 17 years old and am a freshman at Middlesex community college in NJ. Ive always liked taking rides on planes and in the past 2 years have seriously considered flying them as a career. I do have a passion for flying, but I am highly motivated by money. Its probally a 60%/40% with money being 60%. I would Really like to be making atleast $110k per year. I would like to go to a University for Air traffic controll. then go to the airforce for 4-5 years for flying school and airtime.Then I would like to be a commercial Airline pilot for a major airline. I would like to be wealthy and by wealthy I mean owning a nice house ($400k), 2 nice cars (subaru WRX STI and A Evo IX MR =) ). Basically just live comfortably but above average
With The college degree and military expierience would I be one of the most likely caniditates to be hired?
Would the $200k + in debt be worth it?
WHat would my starting pay be?
About how much should i be expecting to make in 5 years?
Any of you know If air traffic controllers realistically see 6 figures?

I read a lot of articals saying the average pilot makes about $130k per year, but from the talk on this boared it seems like a lot less.

Thank you for your time
Amari

Uh-Oh, I can feel Skyhigh circling and ready to descend to runaway with this thread....yes, all puns were intended...:p

It'd be hard to choose a worse path than ERAU. With that kind of debt you can pretty much kiss goodbye any dreams of a comfortable standard of living for the majority of your working life. Read the "Key Alternative Loan & Bankruptcy" thread on the Money Talk board, and "Embry Riddle: to go or not to go" on the Flight Training board.
The consensus of those with actual experience and hindsight is that an aviation school, and ESPECIALLY an aviation degree, is a bad idea. Graduating ERAU with a degree completely useless in the real world, while starting your pilot career not making enough money to pay your $1000 a month student loan payments, is the worst possible way to get started.
ERAU is not well-ranked, and has low admittance standards (around 85%). You'll find its real-world reputation is a far cry from what you'd hear from its recruiting establishment.
Get your ratings at a local FBO, and earn an in-demand business or engineering degree from a respectable state school with an ROTC program. You said "aviation engineering," but I'm not sure if you mean aerospace engineering or aeronautical science. If it's the latter, you might as well get a degree in 14th-Century European Basketry. If it's the former, there are much less expensive, and equally if not more highly respected programs available at the better state schools.

By the way, there's no such thing as a 4-5 year commitment for air force pilots. The minimum service obligation is currently 10 years, not including time in training.

I've been flying over 20 years and have never made $100K, but I will soon. The money can be made, but don't pursue flying for money. Come to think of it, don't pursue money at all. Do what you like, like what you do. Money is not important.

First off, I'd have to say that you're completely clueless about reality or you're flame baiting us, but I will give you the benefit of the doubt and try to educate you.

$200,000 for ERAU? Where are you getting those numbers from? I think it's about $27k a year. So, about $110,000 give or take. It wouldn't even be $200k if you did flight training. $110,000 for a ERAU engineering degree isn't a bad price. Their program is top notch. You could go to MIT and pay $46,350 a year. That's about $185k for 4 years.

If you want to go into the Air Force, why not do ROTC and let the military pay for your engineering degree? You do know that the commitment for a pilot in the Air Force is 10 years AFTER 2 years of training? Your 4-5 year hour building theory is fantasy. Don't join the military to build hours. You'll never get through primary flight training with that attitude. The 5th anniversary of Sept 11th is tomorrow. Join the military to wipe the bastards responsible for that off the planet to better the rest of the world. Not to build hours to land an airline job. After doing 12 years in the Air Force, you will take a PAY CUT to go work for an airline. Most major airlines have a probationary period where you make $35-40k a year for your first year. After 12 years in the Air Force, you'll be making near $100,000 a year in pays/benefits/tax breaks.

Don't get into flying for the money. You'll be very disappointed. The average pilot makes $130,000 a year? What kind of average pilot? The average Legacy FO (First Officer/Copilot) starts at about $55k a year after one year of probation. After 5 years, if everything is still Kosher with the company, you'll probably be in the left seat making $130,000 a year. Regional FO's start at <$20,000 a year. Fractional FO's start at about $40-45k a year. Corporate pilot salaries tend to vary. Some make good money, others start low also, but most of those guys are high time pilots.

Aerospace engineers make good money. I know people who graduated college and landed an engineering job with well known defense companies making $60k a year in an entry level position. Project managers make $100,000+ easily. So, it all depends on what you want to do, but getting into the flying business is a long road fill with pathetic pay checks for quite a long time. The majors are that pot of gold at the end of the rainbow and unfortunately everything up to that point is a stepping stone with stepping stone salaries.

I'd also like to say that ERAU's "real world" reputation is just tainted by some of the jack-offs who come out of there with attitude problems in the flying business. I don't think Uncle Bose has a "real world" opinion about their engineering program and the product they put out into the engineering world, but of course I could be wrong. They are very well respected in the engineering world. Just because you may have had to do a few 4 days with a couple of D-bags out of ERAU, don't write the rest of their programs off as a waste of money. Again, $110k for a great aerospace engineering program is not out of the norm. It's actually on the cheaper side.

My comment about the real-world reputation is meant for the aviation degree program, not the aero E. I wouldn't "write off" their aero E program, but at the same time, it is by no means on the cheaper side. Cheaper side as far as private schools go, sure, but Penn State, UCLA, Berkeley, and a number of other state institutions with highly respected programs cost a fraction of what ERAU charges, assuming resident tuition.

There are many options better than ERAU for someone intersted in being a pilot. No one can tell you the right answer, you need to do a LOT of research...the internet isn't a bad place to start.

"Average Pilot" salary surveys are probably out of the ballpark on the high side for two reasons:

1) They include pre - 9/11 data. The death-spiral of bankruptcies has cut average pay in half, I suspect.

2) Those average numbers include a very few super-senior wide-body captains who make so much $$$ that they skew the average for the rest of us (who will never fly those large airplanes).

Getting to be a wide-body captain is all about seniority...if you want to do it: a) graduate from high school early b) immediately accept an ROTC or service academy scholarship c) upon graduation, get accepted to fly tactical jets d) fly your butt off, volunteer for every sh*thole contingency operation in the third world e) at the end of your minimum committment at age 30 resign and join a major airline. By age 55 you should be able to hold international widebody captain $$$$$$$$$$.

I did all the math, its almost 50k a year. 26k for classes 10k for flight, 7k for room and board. 1k for books and like 2k for food. Thats 46k per year, not to mention taxes if theres any and intrest on loans and misc expenses, it could be a little over 200k after 4 years.

$1000 a year for books? I'd suggest doing your math again, junior.