Cubdriver

Having been through the typical conundrum with this exam, I found it pretty traumatizing. In fact most people do cheat on this exam because the FAA allows it. They won't make the test impervious to memorization. In addition, the exam contains a lot of arguably useless material. But you really should not be a professional pilot if you have such low enough regard for pilot knowledge as to cheat on the exam. That's my position and I am afraid I am in the minority. I took the exam and was frustrated how much useless crap was on it, as well as how it encourages cheating. But at the same time one has to be honest in life, and resorting to cheating via a memory system is not an honorable thing to do. I'll take flak for it I guess, but I think the Shepperd Air system is total dishonesty.

In the end, when en masse cheating occurs as it currently does with this exam, it is evidence the exam and/or its administration is flawed. So along those lines, I would suggest the FAA rewrite the test bank and use material taken from actual airline training exams. My experience with airline training departments is they are very good at writing their own test questions. And the FAA needs to clamp down on the cheating on the ATP exam by making memorization of rote answers more difficult than working problems using knowledge, cultivated thinking skills, and individual judgement.

Paok

I get you want to understand it but I promise you will get a worse score and a 75 on a written never looks good to an examiner. I know several fools in the AF who ran out and got 75's before the aug1 cutoff thinking score doesn't matter. That does not look good, enjoy the oral!!!

USMCFLYR

Cub - if Sheppard Air is cheating so is ANY other type of study guide.
I've been flying on my ATP for coming up on 4 years now and I doubt I've used anything I 'didn't' learn on that test.

I take exception to you labeling me a cheater and unworthy of being a professional pilot based on the fact that I used their study guide and you disregard my other 30 years of aviation experience; but like you said - that is just my humble opinion.

Swedish Blender

Seriously? There were several 727 W&B questions on the written. I practiced a couple, came up with different answers (I was actually flying the 727), and decided to skip the W&B questions on my ATP written. Didn't even do them.

Took my passing grade and along with a F15 guy, took the ATP ride with a cursory oral and no problems for either.

If the minimum wasn't the minimum...

aviatorhi

Cub -

1st get a grip on what I hope is an alter ego, that of the high and mighty sky god of honesty and integrity.

2nd you seem to be under the belief that passing a test one time demonstrates just how amazingly knowledgeable and qualified a person is. The fact is that any individual with a personal interest has the capability to become knowlegeable, with or without a test. All a test ever does is show that you can pass a test, nothing more and nothing less.

Cubdriver

You've got to be kidding. Shepperd is a method precisely aimed at avoiding any real thinking and instead uses some left right up down nonsense instead of actually doing the problems. I have used lots of study guides, one for every written I ever took, and not one was this cheating approach. Not one. Shepperd stands alone on that count.

And the same with all the other writtens, most of it you'll never use. Making the argument that cheating on the test is ok because you might not use it is nonsense. There would be never be any exam on any topic if there was a requirement all the questions need to be used later in life somehow. Tests are on the material in the syllabus of the course. We can argue about the syllabus for ATP and I think that is a valid discussion, but once the syllabus is determined it must be tested on.

You are a high achiever in aviation for sure, bigger better pilot than me also, but this is not one of your high points. Shepperd is a cheating system, period. I am not sure why you are defending a cheating system. The system is broken with regard to the FAA ATP written exam and people are resorting to mass cheating because the exam is not very useful, it's hard as hell if you really do it, and it is also way out of date. Shepperd pandered to the situtation and came up with this cheating method. That does not make it ok though. I am not trying to ride the high horse about being a wonderful guy who does not cheat, I do my share of cheating in life too. But I call a spade a spade, and this Shepperd system is a spade.

Not "dissing" you as an aviator or person USMC, on the contrary I think highly, more pilot than I'll ever be. But I wish you would consider admitting that you got sucked into this nasty cheating system. Let's be friends and make the first thing we agree on that the FAA needs to revap the exam on this area and make it 1) impossible to cheat and 2) not as useless.

tall guy

PLEASE USE SHEPARD AIR!!!!!!!!!! I just got home from taking my atp written. I studied for 3 1/2 weeks and passed!!!! Don't worry about trying to figure out all the critical weight and balance and performance problems. Just remember the correct answer. You will get to know these problems in ground school with whatever airline/commuter you choose. Shepard Air tells their subscribers not to attempt to work out weight and balance problems because you could work it out wrong and end up with the wrong answer, so they advise to just read the question and remember the right answer. I had CRJ performance questions on my written and I just did what Shepard advised. Also the FAA will place an additional 10 questions in which are not in the test bank on the test. If you see any of these questions don't worry about getting them wrong. These questions will not count against you. Remember!!!!!!! there are just over 1200 questions in the test bank. Use Shepard and do what they say and you will get passed it. I took the ATP 121. There is a ATP 135 but I was told everyone takes the ATP 121. Make sure you know which one you are studying for and make sure you tell your CATS administrator which one you are taking.

tall guy

Just to add on the cheating comments...We have no time to talk about cheating on here. The purpose is to get the written done before the deadline. I don't care if you are flying a F-18 or a cessna 152! Get your written done. Please get your written done fellow aviators! No one wants to pay 20k for the course. But if you think its cheating then you can go pay 20k for the course after July 31.

ClarenceOver

I have never seen a fight between two mods before. Who can ban who first?

ClarenceOver

Is the atp written in some regard to the examiner asking questions you missed? What bout those with canned orals and checkrides thanks to an in house designee? I have never had an examiner ask questions about my instrument and commercial writtens when i got 77's on them. Am i missing something in regards to the atp written?