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Old 05-14-2017, 07:51 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by contrails View Post
How did the classroom hours and 14 written exams fair when the chips were down on an A330 over the Atlantic with unreliable airspeed?

Did one of the exams cover what to do when you have +/-10KIAS buffer at FL370?

Continuous full aft sidestick input is the answer, right?
Did tons of experience prevent that American Airlines pilot from overreacting to wake turbulence and causing structural failure to his aircraft and the loss of 265 lives?

Rapid and full rudder deflection is the answer to wake turbulence, right?
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Old 05-14-2017, 08:14 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by NEDude View Post
Did tons of experience prevent that American Airlines pilot from overreacting to wake turbulence and causing structural failure to his aircraft and the loss of 265 lives?

Rapid and full rudder deflection is the answer to wake turbulence, right?

That's actually a bad counter-argument NE. The AA pilot had gone through AA's AAMP program. He did what he thought he was trained to do. The AF F.O. did something that no pilot with any common sense would do. Vastly different example.
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Old 05-14-2017, 08:39 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by Typhoonpilot View Post
That's actually a bad counter-argument NE. The AA pilot had gone through AA's AAMP program. He did what he thought he was trained to do. The AF F.O. did something that no pilot with any common sense would do. Vastly different example.
Okay...

how about an FAA ATP taking off on a wrong runway? How about an FAA ATP stalling his airplane on final approach?

On a different note, how about referring to United Airlines presentation at the North American Airbus Operators Conference in 2011 (might have been 2012) where they shared the results of putting some of their pilots into an Air France scenario in the A320 simulator? Care to take a guess at what percentage of participants, all FAA ATPs, did exactly what the Air France FO did?
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Old 05-15-2017, 03:05 AM
  #94  
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We could do this all day:

Accident: Jet2.com B752 at Alicante on Apr 10th 2017, tail strike on landing


By Simon Hradecky, created Monday, Apr 17th 2017 21:37Z, last updated Tuesday, Apr 18th 2017 12:57Z

A Jet2.com Boeing 757-200, registration G-LSAI performing flight LS-271 from Leeds,EN (UK) to Alicante,SP (Spain) with 230 passengers and 8 crew, landed on Alicante's runway 10 at 12:39L (10:39Z) but bounced on landing prompting the captain to take control of the aircraft, however, the tail of the aircraft struck the runway surface on bounce recovery. The aircraft rolled out without further incident. There were no injuries, the aircraft sustained substantial damage however.

Accident: HiFly A332 at Cologne on Sep 18th 2016, touched down short of runway


By Simon Hradecky, created Friday, Sep 30th 2016 13:25Z, last updated Wednesday, Mar 15th 2017 18:23Z

A HiFly Airbus A330-200 on behalf of WOW Air, registration CS-TQW performing flight WW-752 (dep Sep 17th) from Keflavik (Iceland) to Cologne/Bonn (Germany) with 163 passengers and 11 crew, landed on Cologne's shorter runway 32L at 00:36L (22:36Z Sep 17th), but touched down ahead of the runway threshold. The aircraft rolled out without further incident, vacated the runway at the last exit and taxied to the terminal.

The aircraft remained on the ground in Cologne for 43 hours, then positioned to Beja (Portugal) as flight WW-752P for a safe landing there, but has not resumed service since, 12 days after the landing in Cologne.


Accident: Jet2.com B738 at Funchal on Feb 17th 2014, tail strike on landing


By Simon Hradecky, created Monday, Feb 17th 2014 17:25Z, last updated Friday, Feb 3rd 2017 15:57Z

A Jet2.com Boeing 737-800, registration G-GDFC performing flight LS-389 from Leeds,EN (UK) to Funchal (Portugal) with 176 passengers and 6 crew, landed on Funchal's runway 05 in gusting crosswind conditions, however the tail of the aircraft contacted the runway surface producing visible sparks. The aircraft rolled out without further incident and taxied to the apron. The aircraft received substantial damage.
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Old 05-15-2017, 04:33 AM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by Typhoonpilot View Post
We could do this all day:

Accident: Jet2.com B752 at Alicante on Apr 10th 2017, tail strike on landing


By Simon Hradecky, created Monday, Apr 17th 2017 21:37Z, last updated Tuesday, Apr 18th 2017 12:57Z

A Jet2.com Boeing 757-200, registration G-LSAI performing flight LS-271 from Leeds,EN (UK) to Alicante,SP (Spain) with 230 passengers and 8 crew, landed on Alicante's runway 10 at 12:39L (10:39Z) but bounced on landing prompting the captain to take control of the aircraft, however, the tail of the aircraft struck the runway surface on bounce recovery. The aircraft rolled out without further incident. There were no injuries, the aircraft sustained substantial damage however.

Accident: HiFly A332 at Cologne on Sep 18th 2016, touched down short of runway


By Simon Hradecky, created Friday, Sep 30th 2016 13:25Z, last updated Wednesday, Mar 15th 2017 18:23Z

A HiFly Airbus A330-200 on behalf of WOW Air, registration CS-TQW performing flight WW-752 (dep Sep 17th) from Keflavik (Iceland) to Cologne/Bonn (Germany) with 163 passengers and 11 crew, landed on Cologne's shorter runway 32L at 00:36L (22:36Z Sep 17th), but touched down ahead of the runway threshold. The aircraft rolled out without further incident, vacated the runway at the last exit and taxied to the terminal.

The aircraft remained on the ground in Cologne for 43 hours, then positioned to Beja (Portugal) as flight WW-752P for a safe landing there, but has not resumed service since, 12 days after the landing in Cologne.


Accident: Jet2.com B738 at Funchal on Feb 17th 2014, tail strike on landing


By Simon Hradecky, created Monday, Feb 17th 2014 17:25Z, last updated Friday, Feb 3rd 2017 15:57Z

A Jet2.com Boeing 737-800, registration G-GDFC performing flight LS-389 from Leeds,EN (UK) to Funchal (Portugal) with 176 passengers and 6 crew, landed on Funchal's runway 05 in gusting crosswind conditions, however the tail of the aircraft contacted the runway surface producing visible sparks. The aircraft rolled out without further incident and taxied to the apron. The aircraft received substantial damage.
Yes, you could do it all day and that is the point, this is a ridiculous exercise. The data from the major international aviation and airline organisations is clear, there is very little difference in safety between European and North American airlines. The licensing procedure and requirements of the FAA and EASA yields similar results despite the differences.
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Old 05-15-2017, 06:13 AM
  #96  
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[QUOTE=Typhoonpilot;2363828]A European trolling that the those 14 exams have anything to do with competent pilot skills is funny. I have trained pilots from all over the world for well over two decades and I can very comfortably say that the obsolete theoretical knowledge needed to pass those 14 written exams does not translate to a European pilot being any better than an American who passed the FAA ATP written.[/Quotes ]

A European trolling? What an Arrogant statement from an Ignorant American.

Europe. Written and practical exam to obtain the Radio license.

U.S.A. Send a check to the FCC and you're good.
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Old 05-15-2017, 07:04 AM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by Das Auto View Post
A European trolling? What an Arrogant statement from an Ignorant American.
Prejudiced much?
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Old 05-15-2017, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by ItnStln View Post
Prejudiced much?
I'm a U.S. citizen. Some people get all butt hurt if anyone suggests that not everything is the biggest and best in America.
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Old 05-15-2017, 10:09 AM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by NEDude View Post
On a different note, how about referring to United Airlines presentation at the North American Airbus Operators Conference in 2011 (might have been 2012) where they shared the results of putting some of their pilots into an Air France scenario in the A320 simulator? Care to take a guess at what percentage of participants, all FAA ATPs, did exactly what the Air France FO did?
Northwest had it happen in an A-330 for real in Asia not long before AF did their thing. NWA guys set a pitch and held to it and flew out of it a couple minutes later.

That's what pilots do.

People with 90% classroom time and relief pilot hours may react differently.
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Old 05-15-2017, 11:07 AM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by contrails View Post
Northwest had it happen in an A-330 for real in Asia not long before AF did their thing. NWA guys set a pitch and held to it and flew out of it a couple minutes later.

That's what pilots do.

People with 90% classroom time and relief pilot hours may react differently.
There is a reason why stall training was changed after the Air France accident, and it wasn't just because of that one accident. It was because when conducting research into pilot reactions to similar scenarios, a large percentage of pilots did the same thing the Air France FO did. And yes, that included the American pilots too.
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