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NAI and outcomes

Old 05-16-2017, 07:29 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by NEDude View Post
Okay...

how about an FAA ATP taking off on a wrong runway? How about an FAA ATP stalling his airplane on final approach?

On a different note, how about referring to United Airlines presentation at the North American Airbus Operators Conference in 2011 (might have been 2012) where they shared the results of putting some of their pilots into an Air France scenario in the A320 simulator? Care to take a guess at what percentage of participants, all FAA ATPs, did exactly what the Air France FO did?
UA had a 757 approaching Ireland in 2011 experience the same unreliable airspeed.

Initiated two proper stall recoveries before flying pitch and power.

European pilots lack applied decision making experience as a product of their 'accelerated' training. It's not their fault EASA is in a magenta line mentality but it will manifest itself when shtf.
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Old 05-16-2017, 07:35 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by adebord View Post
UA had a 757 approaching Ireland in 2011 experience the same unreliable airspeed.

Initiated two proper stall recoveries before flying pitch and power.

European pilots lack applied decision making experience as a product of their 'accelerated' training. It's not their fault EASA is in a magenta line mentality but it will manifest itself when shtf.
I am certainly glad you do not engage in gross generalisations...

BTW - Referring to my early comment. United stated, at the 2012 North American Airbus Operators Conference, that 40% of their pilots did the same thing the Air France FO did when put into a similar situation in the A320 sim.

And again...the hard data from ICAO and IATA do not back up your comments.
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Old 05-16-2017, 09:39 AM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by contrails View Post
Northwest had it happen in an A-330 for real in Asia not long before AF did their thing. NWA guys set a pitch and held to it and flew out of it a couple minutes later.

That's what pilots do.

People with 90% classroom time and relief pilot hours may react differently.
Do you have any details on this? I'm only asking because I'd like to look at the differences between the two.
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Old 05-16-2017, 01:15 PM
  #104  
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Originally Posted by adebord View Post
UA had a 757 approaching Ireland in 2011 experience the same unreliable airspeed.

Initiated two proper stall recoveries before flying pitch and power.

European pilots lack applied decision making experience as a product of their 'accelerated' training. It's not their fault EASA is in a magenta line mentality but it will manifest itself when shtf.
I'm sure you have the statistics to back up your claim?

I've been an expat since 1992, conducting line training well before that. I've flown with some great sticks from all over the world and some not so great sticks too. And yes adebord, even from the U.S. It is true that a 250 hour pilot with a frozen ATPL a Boeing/Airbus pilot does not make. It boils down the continued instruction and training they receive when embarking on their career paths from the onset.
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Old 05-16-2017, 02:23 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by Das Auto View Post

A European trolling? What an Arrogant statement from an Ignorant American.

Europe. Written and practical exam to obtain the Radio license.

U.S.A. Send a check to the FCC and you're good.

Hmmm, not that I need to defend myself here, but I have lived and worked in 5 different countries and speak more than one language fluently. As stated before, I have trained and checked numerous EASA license holders over a significant length of time. They are no better than Americans by any measure, no matter how much theory they think they know over and above what a U.S. licensed pilot has learned via practical training

Also I do not claim that Americans are the best pilots in the world. As some may recall if they visit another pilot forum I got into a lengthy discussion on the topic because quite a few Americans were upset that I placed them below number 1 on the list. It's my personal opinion only based on numerous years of training and checking, but I place a couple of other nationalities above Americans as the best overall pilots from a skill and knowledge standpoint as well as being really good guys to fly with. This, of course, is on average. There will always be outliers on either end of the spectrum from all groups.
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Old 05-16-2017, 04:04 PM
  #106  
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..I´ve worked and hold licenses from 3 different continents..When I flew in the US, the pilots there were the best..When I flew in Europe, the pilots there were the best..Now, flying in Asia, the pilots here are the best..As you can see, things keep continuously improving..So what´s next..Africa, maybe ??..

Fly safe,
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:01 PM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by ItnStln View Post
Do you have any details on this? I'm only asking because I'd like to look at the differences between the two.

Google>>Incident: Northwest A333 over East China Sea on Jun 23rd 2009, unreliable airspeed
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:03 PM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by ItnStln View Post
Do you have any details on this? I'm only asking because I'd like to look at the differences between the two.
I remember hearing about it, but the only detail I can recall is that both NWA and Air France had the optional Thales pitot tubes installed as opposed to the standard Goodrich pitot tubes. I think EASA recommended or required all A330/A340 operators replace the Thales system with the Goodrich system.
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Old 05-17-2017, 02:44 AM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by NEDude View Post
I remember hearing about it, but the only detail I can recall is that both NWA and Air France had the optional Thales pitot tubes installed as opposed to the standard Goodrich pitot tubes. I think EASA recommended or required all A330/A340 operators replace the Thales system with the Goodrich system.
Below is the AD issued by EASA


https://ad.easa.europa.eu/blob/easa_...AD_2009-0195_1




For aeroplanes with Thales Avionics P/N C16195BA pitot probes installed at positions 1 and 3: Remove the P/N C16195BA pitot probes from positions 1 and 3, and install Goodrich P/N 0851HL pitot probes at positions 1 and 3, in accordance with the instructions of Airbus SB A330-34-3231, or Airbus SB A340-34-4238, or Airbus SB A340-34-5071, as applicable to aeroplane model.
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Old 05-17-2017, 04:25 AM
  #110  
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Thanks, I'll check it out.
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