RU4692

From what I remember taking Aviation Law in college, any deviations +/- 200 ft in RVSM the ATC computers automatically generate a report logging the "incident". Also, all sorts of bells and whistles start going off to bring it to the attention of the controller.

I fully agree Taylor, never admit to anything especially when your conversation is being recorded. It really astonishes me how fast controllers and Fed's are the brandish their swords when it comes to any sort of non textbook action.

CA1900

"Let me try the other transponder."

⌐ AV8OR WANNABE

Jetjock - I used to help out in the safety department at a regional airline and your situation is more common than you think. Very often when the 300 foot alert is triggered the controlling agency has no other choice than to report it - it's pretty much an automatic process at that point.

If they pursue this and you get a certified letter it’s best to have an attorney represent you - just in case. Someone here said the FAA has 2 weeks to send you a letter? Definitely not true as I’ve seen some of our pilots get letters several weeks after the incident.

IF they pursue it, the worst that can happen to you is a warning letter because of the NASA form that you filled out. Let’s say they want to yank your license for 30 days (very doubtful) – in that case your file would read that the NASA Form #.. was being used in lieu of the 30 day suspension… So you’d keep your license but the violation would still show on your record. However, this is if they actually want to go after you which like I said is very doubtful.

Some people here say to “fight it” – well, when it comes to warning letters there’s actually not much we, the pilots can do. It’s the lowest of offenses and basically means you made a boo-boo but it’s not important enough for them to spend the time and the money to further investigate it so instead they’re giving you this warning letter or the “notice of warning” which will expire from your file 24 months form the date of the letter…

The advantage of it is that it’s a temporary blemish; the disadvantage is that you cannot appeal it – the feds have the final say. Trust me, some of my friends tried to spend some big bucks on really good aviation attorneys but they all said you really can’t fight a warning letter.

So the question is once it expires, were you ever violated? Well, I’ve heard many different things on this subject but 24 months after the violation (or offense ) it expires automatically. Personally I’d still bring it up because honesty always prevails but also so you have a neat story to tell… “This is how I screwed up and this is what I did to make sure it never happens again…”

The way things are looking, not many airlines will be hiring in the next 2 years so before you know it the 2 years blemish (IF you get one) will be gone…

Hope things work out for you..

illinipilot

Do warning letters show up on your permenant (sp) record?

jaxpilot

no, letters of correction and letters of warning both are expunged from your FAA file after 2 years. Also they are not on your PRIA record during that time, they will only show up with a Freedom of Information Act request, which some employers do but most dont. They are not considered a violation, only an enforcement action.

ToiletDuck

You don't know who was watching them when it happened(or audited after). We had someone ASAP at RAH--> "When below 10,000ft I became overwhelmed and stated how much I love my job thus breaking the silent cockpit rule". I might have goofed it a touch but that was it no lie. Just depends on who's watching lol.

ToiletDuck

If you submit an ASAP it will automatically file a NASA form.

⌐ AV8OR WANNABE

Not always true, at UPS you have you have mark "Yes" to a question asking if you want them to file a NASA form along with your ASAP report... I believe it was the same at one of my previous airlines...

⌐ AV8OR WANNABE

I recommend you contact John Ryan at the OKC FSDO – he’s the guy who's in charge of the PRIA program. In fact, his signature is probably on the last background check your airline received on you.
He's very down to earth and can give you lots of good info if you're interested. I can PM you his email address if you want.

Jaxpilot's info is correct. According to John Ryan a warning letter is NOT a violation but rather an enforcement action.
It expires automatically 24 months later (occasionally the time frame is shorter - up to the local FSDO - but it doesn't happen very often).

So will it show in your permanent file? Well, it depends. If the airline does the “regular” PRIA check - probably not. However, if they suspect something later they can always go back and do a more thorough investigation and the info will probably be there (let say one of your so called friends says “I heard he was violated a while back” - yes as a former regional recruiter unfortunately I've seen "friends" do this to each other )

Something to consider - as mentioned earlier a warning letter expires automatically. However, what does not expire automatically is the investigating FSDO's paperwork. In other words all the findings which led them to issuing you a warning letter do not expire. Therefore, if you really want to keep it 'secret' (personally I recommend being honest about any infractions) make sure no one knows about it.

I mention this because I vividly remember a person being pulled from a class at AirTran for “being less than truthful” during his interview. A recruiter told us later that the infraction was absolutely silly and the guys would’ve been hired anyway. Once he ‘omitted” things though – it was a different story…

Either way, this sounds like a very minor pilot deviation; I’m sure things will turn out for you just fine…

VmoMmo

Wondering aloud how much of an issue this would have been pre-RVSM days...

N1234 say altitude!!!
FL350 sir, why?
We show ya 300 feet high.
Hmmm, strange.....want me to try the other txpdr? <cough>