Questions from propsective Citation Shares customer
11-11-2008, 10:08 AM
#1
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Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 3
Questions from propsective Citation Shares customer
Thinking about purchasing a Vector jetcard from Citation Shares. Currently have Marquis card through NetJets.
First off, my continued thanks to the NJ pilots. You guys (and gals) are terrific.
Just wanted to take the pulse of the knowledgable folks here who post and get your thoughts on Citation's current operations. We went with NetJets for our current jetcard because of its perceived commitment to safety (pilot training, maintenance, etc). It is pretty hard to research this topic, so I wanted to see what the consensus is with respect to Citation's operations. Citation's jetcard offers a bit more flexibility with plane choice, hence my interest in switching.
Thanks very much for your help--really appreciate it!
First off, my continued thanks to the NJ pilots. You guys (and gals) are terrific.
Just wanted to take the pulse of the knowledgable folks here who post and get your thoughts on Citation's current operations. We went with NetJets for our current jetcard because of its perceived commitment to safety (pilot training, maintenance, etc). It is pretty hard to research this topic, so I wanted to see what the consensus is with respect to Citation's operations. Citation's jetcard offers a bit more flexibility with plane choice, hence my interest in switching.
Thanks very much for your help--really appreciate it!
11-11-2008, 03:16 PM
#2
Banned
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Space Shuttle PIC
Posts: 2,007
Originally Posted by qwert512
Thinking about purchasing a Vector jetcard from Citation Shares. Currently have Marquis card through NetJets.
First off, my continued thanks to the NJ pilots. You guys (and gals) are terrific.
Just wanted to take the pulse of the knowledgable folks here who post and get your thoughts on Citation's current operations. We went with NetJets for our current jetcard because of its perceived commitment to safety (pilot training, maintenance, etc). It is pretty hard to research this topic, so I wanted to see what the consensus is with respect to Citation's operations. Citation's jetcard offers a bit more flexibility with plane choice, hence my interest in switching.
Thanks very much for your help--really appreciate it!
First off, my continued thanks to the NJ pilots. You guys (and gals) are terrific.
Just wanted to take the pulse of the knowledgable folks here who post and get your thoughts on Citation's current operations. We went with NetJets for our current jetcard because of its perceived commitment to safety (pilot training, maintenance, etc). It is pretty hard to research this topic, so I wanted to see what the consensus is with respect to Citation's operations. Citation's jetcard offers a bit more flexibility with plane choice, hence my interest in switching.
Thanks very much for your help--really appreciate it!
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead. If you look at it from an hourly basis, you could probably charter a much bigger airplane from a "reputable" charter operator for the same hourly cost (including fuel) because you are not funding their enormous overhead. Charter operators are rated (Argus and others) and you look for highly-rated operators who can provide the same or bigger aircraft for the same (or much lower) price offered by the jetcard schemes. I would ask for charter customer references during your due diligence.
Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there... You are paying a huge premium for the brand name and "implied" reputation for safety. In doing so, are you suggesting that corporate or private operators are any less safe and reliable because they don't buy fractional shares? They care about safety too - most pilots don't have a death wish. Most highly-rated charter operators care deeply about their reputation for safety and operating standards. I don't work in the industry but my opinion is based on what friends who do work in the industry think... You need to shop around.
Have you ever done this price/value comparison between fractional cards and "reputable" charter operators?
Last edited by Bill Lumberg; 11-11-2008 at 03:30 PM.
11-11-2008, 04:28 PM
#3
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Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 436
Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead... Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there...
Geez, Bill you really missed the point on this one. Charter operators charge you for repositioning time. Card holders pay only for the occupied time. The level of consistent, quality service of the fractionals far exceeds that of the charter operators. While I obviously wish this questioner was looking at my company as well as CitationShares, I know that he will do better with them than with a charter operator.
11-11-2008, 04:46 PM
#4
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Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 3
Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg
To my knowledge, no Citationshares aircraft have crashed. The pilots are all trained at very high standards. I'd say the standards are comparable to Netjets in terms of pilot hiring and training. You probably already know this but I would make sure that the aircraft fleet offered matches your requirements. If you consistently need 3-4 passengers flown 500 miles, a CJ3 or XLS at Citationshares might work well for you. If you require trips to Hawaii or Europe, Citationshares won't provide aircraft capable of some of those missions.
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead. If you look at it from an hourly basis, you could probably charter a much bigger airplane from a "reputable" charter operator for the same hourly cost (including fuel) because you are not funding their enormous overhead. Charter operators are rated (Argus and others) and you look for highly-rated operators who can provide the same or bigger aircraft for the same (or much lower) price offered by the jetcard schemes. I would ask for charter customer references during your due diligence.
Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there... You are paying a huge premium for the brand name and "implied" reputation for safety. In doing so, are you suggesting that corporate or private operators are any less safe and reliable because they don't buy fractional shares? They care about safety too - most pilots don't have a death wish. Most highly-rated charter operators care deeply about their reputation for safety and operating standards. I don't work in the industry but my opinion is based on what friends who do work in the industry think... You need to shop around.
Have you ever done this price/value comparison between fractional cards and "reputable" charter operators?
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead. If you look at it from an hourly basis, you could probably charter a much bigger airplane from a "reputable" charter operator for the same hourly cost (including fuel) because you are not funding their enormous overhead. Charter operators are rated (Argus and others) and you look for highly-rated operators who can provide the same or bigger aircraft for the same (or much lower) price offered by the jetcard schemes. I would ask for charter customer references during your due diligence.
Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there... You are paying a huge premium for the brand name and "implied" reputation for safety. In doing so, are you suggesting that corporate or private operators are any less safe and reliable because they don't buy fractional shares? They care about safety too - most pilots don't have a death wish. Most highly-rated charter operators care deeply about their reputation for safety and operating standards. I don't work in the industry but my opinion is based on what friends who do work in the industry think... You need to shop around.
Have you ever done this price/value comparison between fractional cards and "reputable" charter operators?
Citation's plane choices should be fine for my needs (under 2.5 hr trips across east coast/midwest).
11-11-2008, 06:43 PM
#6
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Look, if you have the money to burn then go for it. The amount per hour for those cards is outrageous but when did that matter to super rich people? I was just trying to offer an obvious alternative (there are quality charter operators out there). Citationshares should work for you.
11-11-2008, 07:58 PM
#7
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 60
Bill is correct, we (CS) have had no crashes. As a whole the fractional industry has a superior safety record when compared to the average 135 carrier. Disclaimer - just talking numbers, again, Bill is correct about there being excellent charter outfits out there. NJ and CS both train at Flight Safety and both outfits are pretty well plugged in to the whole customer service thing. If you've been happy with your service, it comes down to what program best fits your needs. If you have CS specific questions, feel free to PM me (after you get 10 posts).
11-12-2008, 04:39 AM
#8
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Posts: 286
qwert512,
As my colleague stated above, we (CS) train at FlightSafety as does NetJets. FS is very good at what they do and I have been very impressed with their product. As a reference, I came from the Part 121(airline) side of the industry.
CitationShares is very proud of our customer service aspect of the business. We have a highly motivated group of team members here, and we want exceed your expectations on every trip.
If you have any specific questions, I would also be happy to answer via PM.
Hope to see you on one of "our" airplanes soon!
Regards,
X
As my colleague stated above, we (CS) train at FlightSafety as does NetJets. FS is very good at what they do and I have been very impressed with their product. As a reference, I came from the Part 121(airline) side of the industry.
CitationShares is very proud of our customer service aspect of the business. We have a highly motivated group of team members here, and we want exceed your expectations on every trip.
If you have any specific questions, I would also be happy to answer via PM.
Hope to see you on one of "our" airplanes soon!
Regards,
X
11-12-2008, 05:19 AM
#9
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Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: CE560XLS PIC
Posts: 10
Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg
To my knowledge, no Citationshares aircraft have crashed. The pilots are all trained at very high standards. I'd say the standards are comparable to Netjets in terms of pilot hiring and training. You probably already know this but I would make sure that the aircraft fleet offered matches your requirements. If you consistently need 3-4 passengers flown 500 miles, a CJ3 or XLS at Citationshares might work well for you. If you require trips to Hawaii or Europe, Citationshares won't provide aircraft capable of some of those missions.
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead. If you look at it from an hourly basis, you could probably charter a much bigger airplane from a "reputable" charter operator for the same hourly cost (including fuel) because you are not funding their enormous overhead. Charter operators are rated (Argus and others) and you look for highly-rated operators who can provide the same or bigger aircraft for the same (or much lower) price offered by the jetcard schemes. I would ask for charter customer references during your due diligence.
Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there... You are paying a huge premium for the brand name and "implied" reputation for safety. In doing so, are you suggesting that corporate or private operators are any less safe and reliable because they don't buy fractional shares? They care about safety too - most pilots don't have a death wish. Most highly-rated charter operators care deeply about their reputation for safety and operating standards. I don't work in the industry but my opinion is based on what friends who do work in the industry think... You need to shop around.
Have you ever done this price/value comparison between fractional cards and "reputable" charter operators?
Keep in mind that when you buy these jetcards you are basically paying a huge premium to cover their extensive overhead. If you look at it from an hourly basis, you could probably charter a much bigger airplane from a "reputable" charter operator for the same hourly cost (including fuel) because you are not funding their enormous overhead. Charter operators are rated (Argus and others) and you look for highly-rated operators who can provide the same or bigger aircraft for the same (or much lower) price offered by the jetcard schemes. I would ask for charter customer references during your due diligence.
Personally, I think these jetcards are a huge waste of money when compared to some of the more "reputable" charter operators out there... You are paying a huge premium for the brand name and "implied" reputation for safety. In doing so, are you suggesting that corporate or private operators are any less safe and reliable because they don't buy fractional shares? They care about safety too - most pilots don't have a death wish. Most highly-rated charter operators care deeply about their reputation for safety and operating standards. I don't work in the industry but my opinion is based on what friends who do work in the industry think... You need to shop around.
Have you ever done this price/value comparison between fractional cards and "reputable" charter operators?
I flew at CitationShares for almost 4 years and left and went to Netjets. Want to know why.? PM me
11-12-2008, 05:26 AM
#10
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: Furloughed
Posts: 429
As one of the dozen or so pilots this year who have made the switch from CS to NJA I can shockingly say the difference is night and day. CS is a great place with a strong commitment to safety but they are behind in NJ in several areas. They are going through a lot of the growing pains that NJ has already dealt with. Owner Services and billing are the biggest complaints of CS customers. CS just hasnt implemented the technology needed to make a strong dispatch department (CS pilots file their own flight plans and get their own weather, do their own weight and balance) all things that take away time that should be spent getting the airplane ready for the owner. Another huge difference is recovery times. Every MX problem at NJ seems to have another NJ plane landing within an hour while CS's response times usually involve 3 or 4 hours and often and outside vendor. Both are great companies just one is a little more mature. I will say both have strong committment to pilot training and safety. Please feel free to PM for more info
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