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09-19-2017, 04:17 AM
#2601
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2014
Posts: 162
Originally Posted by GeeWizDriver
For a senior PIC, the gig isn't awful. For a junior FO, it's depressing. For a new hire, it would be suicidal.
Run, don't walk, the other direction.
Run, don't walk, the other direction.
09-19-2017, 04:19 AM
#2602
Speed, Power, Accuracy
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: PIC
Posts: 1,700
Originally Posted by Nachomamma
Applicants...are we starting to see a theme here? I get that your current 135 gig sucks. NJ knows that and is hoping you'll overlook the impending train wreck in favor of improving your current crappy situation. But don't go there thinking you'll make this a career. It isn't, and without a mandatory age cap, it never will be. If you must work there, don't plan on staying very long. Take the free type rating and leave as soon as possible.
09-19-2017, 10:39 AM
#2603
What's A Weekend?
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: Big...So Big
Posts: 803
Classes
I've read this thread for some time, and keep seeing people saying that NJ hasn't/won't be running any classes. Then, I run into a NJ FO in BWI that says he's been there 8 months (Phenom). Confusing??
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
09-19-2017, 02:00 PM
#2604
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2017
Posts: 92
Originally Posted by Lowlevel
I've read this thread for some time, and keep seeing people saying that NJ hasn't/won't be running any classes. Then, I run into a NJ FO in BWI that says he's been there 8 months (Phenom). Confusing??
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
09-19-2017, 02:52 PM
#2605
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 40
Originally Posted by Lowlevel
I've read this thread for some time, and keep seeing people saying that NJ hasn't/won't be running any classes. Then, I run into a NJ FO in BWI that says he's been there 8 months (Phenom). Confusing??
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
I also follow a few other threads, where most speak very badly about their company (or former company). A week ago I stayed at a hotel, that was a crew hotel for one of those companies. I met 8 pilots (5 FO/3 Captain), and 4 FAs, and everyone liked their job. Sure, not a major percentage of the entire pilot group, but still, not one person hated the place like people posting online.
I just take the good, and the bad, and make up my own mind.
Shared a van with a NJ crew today, at 04:45. They like the place.
09-19-2017, 04:04 PM
#2607
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: ANG
Posts: 276
After reading all the negative stuff on here about NJA, let me post some positive stuff. I've been thinking a lot about it recently as I have an SWA interview coming up and it has made me realize that I do have it pretty good here.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
09-19-2017, 05:28 PM
#2608
Speed, Power, Accuracy
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: PIC
Posts: 1,700
Originally Posted by dudemize
After reading all the negative stuff on here about NJA, let me post some positive stuff. I've been thinking a lot about it recently as I have an SWA interview coming up and it has made me realize that I do have it pretty good here.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
I'm happy that you're happy and that you might have an opportunity to experience the Luv.
But please, do me a favor, STOP including per diem as part of your compensation. It IS NOT PART OF YOUR PAY. Also, if you think our health care is "100% free," I'd love for you to take over paying for all the "free" health care my better half has incurred over the past few years.
The over-riding point that some of us are making is that, given our management's ethical and business lapses, the realities of our market segment, current regulation (no mandatory retirement), and pilot group demographic, there are better career opportunities for younger pilots seeking a new job.
It's not whining. It's a reality check. And a warning.
09-19-2017, 06:00 PM
#2609
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Position: Left
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by dudemize
After reading all the negative stuff on here about NJA, let me post some positive stuff. I've been thinking a lot about it recently as I have an SWA interview coming up and it has made me realize that I do have it pretty good here.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
I am a 10 yr FO (just started 11 yr pay and also have 4 weeks vacation this year for the first time). I will make roughly 100k this year, not including per diem or 401(k) match. I am on the CC52 schedule, working 13 days/month. I am home based so those 13 days are all in. No commuting on my own time. I have 150ish (new hires have 105 or something like that) bases to choose from and can change anytime with 15 days notice.
For Oct I will work a 7 day trip, have 15 off, 6 day trip, 3 off. Pretty typical month. Occasionally I will have an 8 day tour in there.
Vacation months are pretty sweet as I will work 6 days those months. With 4 weeks vacation plus a week of personal time (which I always use), I will work 6 days for 5 months out of the year. 2 more weeks per year is training, so I will only fly the line 6 days those months. So I will be out flying 6 days for 7 months of the year, the rest I will fly 13. I have blocked 305 hrs in the last 12 months. I'm on the Phenom and we do not work that hard. I average about 25 hrs for a 7 day tour. We do our share of 12 hr+ duty days but it is not that bad. We had 26 hr duty days in the military with massive time zone shifts so this is a piece of cake. If we are too tired, we fatigue, end of story.
We have 100% free medical/dental/vision.
Am I disappointed over my lack of career progression? Of course, but my QOL is very good and I still make plenty to support my family and still max out my 401(k) and IRAs. I wish the compensation was better, hopefully that will be improved next contract, whenever that might be (earliest will be 2020).
If I get the opportunity with SWA and accept, I will certainly make more cash over the long run (particularly if you include retirement and profit sharing contributions). As a commuter I do not think my QOL will be any better, at least not for some time. I do love SWA as a company and have many friends there. I think the flexibility and ability to drop (with seniority) or pick up trips would be awesome. Shorter duty days but a LOT more butt in the seat time. Commuting will suck for sure as that will be lost days at home.
The point of this is to say that NJA is a good gig. I am happy and grateful to be here. If you can't handle schedule changes or having to clean an airplane then do not come here. If you want to fly to some cool places with (mostly) great folks, have a great schedule*, and decent pay, then give it a shot. If I wind up leaving it will be with mixed emotions for sure.
*assuming you are not on the CC72 or CC76, those suck. Good thing they are voluntary.
09-19-2017, 06:21 PM
#2610
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: ANG
Posts: 276
Originally Posted by GeeWizDriver
Dude,
I'm happy that you're happy and that you might have an opportunity to experience the Luv.
But please, do me a favor, STOP including per diem as part of your compensation. It IS NOT PART OF YOUR PAY. Also, if you think our health care is "100% free," I'd love for you to take over paying for all the "free" health care my better half has incurred over the past few years.
The over-riding point that some of us are making is that, given our management's ethical and business lapses, the realities of our market segment, current regulation (no mandatory retirement), and pilot group demographic, there are better career opportunities for younger pilots seeking a new job.
It's not whining. It's a reality check. And a warning.
I'm happy that you're happy and that you might have an opportunity to experience the Luv.
But please, do me a favor, STOP including per diem as part of your compensation. It IS NOT PART OF YOUR PAY. Also, if you think our health care is "100% free," I'd love for you to take over paying for all the "free" health care my better half has incurred over the past few years.
The over-riding point that some of us are making is that, given our management's ethical and business lapses, the realities of our market segment, current regulation (no mandatory retirement), and pilot group demographic, there are better career opportunities for younger pilots seeking a new job.
It's not whining. It's a reality check. And a warning.
I said that my pay was NOT including per diem as I agree that it is not part of compensation. Some do though so I just wanted to make sure that everyone understood that it was not included.
Certainly if someone has an offer from SWA or a Legacy vs NJA, it is a no brainer to go with the former (unless they REALLY didn't want to commute). My point was that I have it pretty good and, other than pay, I would put my QOL on par with just about anyone.
You are correct about the medical. I should have said Zero premium medical/dental/vision. Certainly there are co-pays in there. My son just had some minor surgery, had to pay $100.
It's all good though. I hope everyone gets where they want to be!
Last edited by dudemize; 09-19-2017 at 06:32 PM.
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