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Old 11-02-2017, 07:23 AM   #411  
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Alaska/Virgin got shafted on scope. The pay and retirement are well within the averages.

There is certainly a lot of risk in going down the road of arbitration. They did however get a deal completed in a timely fashion. Hopefully the lack of scope doesn't come back to bite them. Can you even imagine having someone like Republic flying E190s for you??? Oh wait...
Hopefully ?! Bwahahahaha - we all know the answer to that question.

I am sure every airline can get a horrible contract quickly.

Pay rates mean diddly squat when there is no scope.......work rules are EVERYTHING and pay rates are secondary.
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Old 11-02-2017, 08:50 AM   #412  
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April 2018
SWA 258.30
ALK 258.53
15% 401K

April 2019
SWA 266.04
ALK 266.29
15.5% 401K

Yup Alaska got screwed... VX too. We have early openers starting in a year right with UAL, DAL, AMR.
Really?
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Old 11-02-2017, 09:36 AM   #413  
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Old 11-02-2017, 02:27 PM   #414  
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April 2018
SWA 258.30
ALK 258.53
15% 401K

April 2019
SWA 266.04
ALK 266.29
15.5% 401K

Yup Alaska got screwed... VX too. We have early openers starting in a year right with UAL, DAL, AMR.
Really?
If there was a possibility of voting no to TWICE those numbers I would in a heartbeat with that scope language.
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Old 11-02-2017, 05:35 PM   #415  
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I sincerely hope you guys get scope and way better rates. Personally though scope has never paid my bills or sent me on vacation. In meantime your 12 year CA is making 161.68 and a 12 year FO at Alaska is making 173.74.
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Old 11-02-2017, 08:07 PM   #416  
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I sincerely hope you guys get scope and way better rates. Personally though scope has never paid my bills or sent me on vacation. In meantime your 12 year CA is making 161.68 and a 12 year FO at Alaska is making 173.74.
Scope will matter when they're farming out flying and you're looking at a downgrade.

The rest of the contract matters just as much if not more than hourly rates. With the right soft time language you can make several dollars per hour less than the top figure and still take home more.

Last edited by etflies; 11-02-2017 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 11-03-2017, 05:18 AM   #417  
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Other airlines will sign contracts soon. Will they do any better then Alaskas arbitrated award. I donít think so.
Likely pay scales
JetBlue 245$
Spirit 235$
Frontier 225$
They will all find pilots too, near term
This guy has been trying to manage expectations for 4 different companies. If he is happy with the AS award then fine. Hell, Iím happy for them too so long as the company doesnít screw them on scope. He knows what works for him and we know what works for us.

I hope we are both right but for now why engage a guy that doesnít even work here when he says things like ďscope never paid my billsĒ? The only thing thatíll educate that kind of short-sightedness is watching your flying go away and not being able to collect on those pay rates.
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Old 11-03-2017, 06:01 AM   #418  
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I sincerely hope you guys get scope and way better rates. Personally though scope has never paid my bills or sent me on vacation. In meantime your 12 year CA is making 161.68 and a 12 year FO at Alaska is making 173.74.
If you honestly believe this then you are beyond hope!

Scope is the only thing that will allow you to count on paying your bills or your ability to go on vacation! Without it, your job (and thus your livelihood) can be outsourced tomorrow.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:12 AM   #419  
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If you honestly believe this then you are beyond hope!

Scope is the only thing that will allow you to count on paying your bills or your ability to go on vacation! Without it, your job (and thus your livelihood) can be outsourced tomorrow.
Canít remember a company who doesnít like to outsource. Plus itíll be huge negotiating leverage for management when the time comes. Sucks.
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Old 11-03-2017, 10:16 AM   #420  
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I sincerely hope you guys get scope and way better rates. Personally though scope has never paid my bills or sent me on vacation. In meantime your 12 year CA is making 161.68 and a 12 year FO at Alaska is making 173.74.
It is people like you and your absurd logic that was responsible for the massive outsourcing of flying from the major airlines to their regional affiliates.

That outsourcing caused an explosive growth in the regional airlines and pinned hundreds of thousands of aviators at the regional level with grossly substandard wages.

Your 'I've got mine, screw scope' attitude virtually ruined this industry as a lucrative career.
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