Frontier or Atlas
 

I know it's apples to oranges but I'm looking for insight from anyone who has possibly worked at both or any other insight into a decision like this. I have prospects at both of these airlines for classes in the near future.

-I would be commuting either way, I don't live in an F9 or Atlas base.
-No young kids or commitments that would prevent the longer schedules at Atlas.
-I like life outside of work so the F9 scheduling flexibility entices me.
-I like the idea of flying heavies around the world for the experiences but also not sure if I would enjoy it long term or 10 years down the line. Just haven't experienced it for myself but have heard a lot of different feelings. Some love it, some hate it after two to three years.
-F9 seniority prospects with the aircraft deliveries is good.
-Atlas is supposedly nearing a new contract and might pay more?

Thoughts?

Depends on your future plans. Long term outlook with (planned) rapid seniority growth will drastically improve your QoL at F9. The pay is great especially if you can relocate to live in base. Can’t comment much about ATLAS but I feel like it would get old after awhile.. I could be wrong though!

As it stands right this moment, F9 is a better deal IMO.

Our contract, QOL, and aircraft order all will lead to better career prospects. Atlas with a new contract might be an enticing offer, but they've been in the trenches for years trying to get a new contract amended. As of right now, the contract situation at Atlas is sitting in the hands of an arbitrator which could go either way.

If you are trying to ballpark what the new Atlas contract will look like, take a peak at Kalitta and see how that makes you feel. I have a feeling that the Atlas contract will be within an earshot of that (Kalitta +1). I can't guess how much value you place on flying widebody aircraft, but the Airbus is a pretty great airplane to work with. I regularly get 17+ days off per month as a lineholder and when I do work, the job is enjoyable at F9.

Some things to consider are options to pick up overtime and retirement contributions. I don't know how old you are but the 14% direct contribution is a huge gain over that of what most ACMI are going to offer for retirement packages. Additionally, from what little I know about cargo flying, picking up overtime isn't exactly all that easy whereas at F9 it's very easy to credit 100 hours per month with 14-15 days off.

Lastly, you may want to consider moving to base with F9. A lot of our trips are becoming day trips meaning if you do opt to commute you may have some difficulty building a schedule that will maximize the return on your crashpad investment. Atlas offers positive space to work so that's a benefit in regards to them.

Best of luck to you on your decision.

The simple answer is whoever gets you in class first, if covid has taught us anything. But assuming it’s the same time F9 is the way better sure bet. Pay, contract, qol, retirement contributions, and growth are all for F9.

One caveat being where you live. If it’s west of the Mississippi commuting won’t be fun. Until PHX and/or any other western bases open up you’ll be commuting to the east coast for a bit. Maybe you could hold reserve in DEN/LAS but I feel like it’d be a while for a line. Things change every day but that’s my interpretation.

I don’t know much about Atlas to be fair. I’m sure there’s someone here at frontier that came from Atlas and can maybe give some better advice. This is just an opinion from one dude.

I live east of the Mississippi, PHL would be the easiest commute for me. Is it still the most junior?

I think MIA is but it’s at least 2nd most junior. PHL will always be junior. Things are still out of whack but I imagine PHL/MIA will always be most junior. Plus ATL is supposed to open Q4.

I think you’ve really answered your own question…it’s apples and oranges. Would you rather fly heavies around the world on long schedules for your career, or narrow bodies domestically? Only you can answer that.


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Atlas will eventually get a new contract and, like someone else has said, I'd expect it to be in the ballpark of Kalitta. Only you can truly decide what is right for you. You mentioned that you don't have kids or any major commitments... What are the chances of that changing in the future? You also seem to sound like it's more of a bucket list thing (flying heavies) than your desire to stay long term. In that case, how much seniority are you willing to give up at a traditional airline (Frontier in this case) to fulfill that bucket list item?

My personal story... I would have loved to have had the experience of flying heavies around the world. I dedicated all my energy on getting hired at Frontier. However, if I had been a little younger or my wife had not been really pushing to start having kids at the time, I would have likely pushed for Atlas or Kalitta, spent six months to a year there to have had the experience of flying a 747 around the world, and then pursued Frontier. I would have been willing to take the seniority hit to do it. Unfortunately for me, my personal and family dedications at the time didn't line up with an ability for me to be selfish in my employer choices to simply check off a bucket list item. It doesn't sound like that is necessarily the case for you. The big questions are simply: How much seniority are you willing to give up in order to fly a heavy at a non-career destination, and will you be able to be happy there long term if the industry craps itself again?

If you’re looking at the Majors then heavy International time will look better on your resume then narrow body domestic only.
Go Atlas, get 1000 hrs heavy time then reevaluate your goals.

I tend to agree with this statement. IMO, if you are youngish, get 2-3 years of heavy time now while you can (everyone I know who has flown the 747/Queen has loved the experience) and then reevaluate. Maybe you will love it and continue (even though you might be jet lagged and exhausted if you fly the 747). After a few years you can apply to all of the legacies and LCCs and be reasonably well positioned if you want to leave cargo flying. Just my opinion.... Let us know if which way you go.