dracir1

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/a...ence-guide.pdf

BiffleBalls

Wow.

filler

FlyingR6

Thanks for posting. I hadn't seen the full duration pay scale, and some of those finer points.

ULLI

One of the key things is 321neo scales. That's becoming standard now. UA will have the same

dracir1

Yes. These are essentially the same rates as DL. Doing the math, the difference in our 1st yr CA rate (196.88) and these equates to 120.88. 12 yr CA rate difference is 87.29. Add those 2 differences and divide by two comes to 104.9 (of course, it's not linear as our slope is heavily senior skewed but this is a good estimation). Come Aug 1st when their AIP is signed, both DL and AA 321 pilots (and keep in mind the AA 321 neo has 194 seats) will be making 40% more money PER HOUR w/ UA soon to follow. This of course, doesn't include the 16% DC as well as their profit sharing. And don't forget the annual raises.

We were so far behind last contract cycle that we were told we couldn't make up ALL the pay difference ground. Will we be able to this time?

Maybe a better question is - what will happen to this company in terms of hiring and retention if we don't?

hercretired

notable "nice things" in AA AIP

fly-on-holiday extra pay
international pay
sick leave cash-out, very smart, sick calls will go down and staffing will be improved
Premium pay if Pilot elects to train on days off

ULLI

I don't recall what the initial raise was last time. But it was definitely over 25-30%, which is what we need this time for market rates. I belive that's realistic for us
Retention is a completely different topic, that will definitely be a hurdle for the company.

hercretired

not sure if we have conclusive data to show that "more pay to stay" in regards to Frontier pilots

ULLI

Agreed, pay is one of many things that will need to be chnaged

spooldup

I swear if our NC doesn't try to come close to this and match *WHATEVER is in the CURRENT year's PAY, for first year pay then % increase from there* I will be upset. I dont want 2023 pay rates in 2026 or 2027.

We CANNOT be so far behind this time. This is industry standard and these airlines are showing us this. Spirit and JB are NOT what we should be near, their pay is current hold over until a new JCBA and if it doesnt happen, they will negotiate new CBAs themselves.

our management cannot keep this airline running if we get a subpar contract. I, as well as many others will be out the door to any of the other legacies in a heart beat and F9 will forever be a regional taking fresh ATPs with a turnover equal to OO. They will be forcing upgrades and suffering trying to keep people past 3 years.

These airlines have also shown that seats matter. 319/320/321/321neo rates all usually different. If we dont have AT LEAST the other airlines 320/1 rates.... ridiculous first TA to even push through to us. Especially since we are getting Mostly 321neos for the foreseeable future with 240 seats.