How are ATP grads viewed by other pilots
 

Just out of curiosity, do other pilots look down on ATP grads? I know there are issues with young guys coming in after the 90 program that have about 500TT and then think they are the sh!t. What about those that very modest, respectful, humble, and eager to learn? Are those pilots looked down on also just because they did the 90day program?

It's all about attitude. Too many that are coming out of there have this stupid and unfounded belief that they are some sort of superpilot because they have a little time in a CRJ sim.

There's no way you can digest enough in that short of a time or for that matter, see enough different situations to be a safe pilot. Remember, the PTS only sets forth the MINIMUM standards required to obtain a rating. That's exactly what you're going to learn in that short amount of time.

500?
 

The only guys that come out with 500 hrs are the guys that showed up with a lot (300 maybe) of hours.

I have found that typically a different type of personality goes to ATP then other schools. The "Get it all as fast as physically possible and who cares what they charge me for it"

In some people that tends to be an issue with me but in others it does not. I work as a CFI with an ATP grad and he is a great guy and an even better pilot. We have had a few other ATP guys apply and not get hired due to their lack of knowledge. That may or may not reflect the teachings of ATP.

What I meant with 500TT is what they are getting hired with after instructing for a little while..

So if they have a humble additude, knowing they still have much to learn, you wouldn't really mind flying with them?

Ok, here's my take on it. It's when people either ask or announce right from their first or second sentence where they went as a way to "Size Up" the person they are talking to, I have a problem. I went to a "Big, but small" program. I'd like to think we have a reputation for being good. Do I use that in my first sentence, nope. Only until asked where I went do I usually say where I went. As far as folks asking about good places to learn to fly, I'd recommend it openly though too. So I guess my point is, it's when people use where they went as a way to define their superiority to someone else, I have a problem with it. And 99% of the time, they'll probably get their asses handed to them anyways for being a cocky lil one too!

In the end, we're all on the same team, and who really cares, that's my attitude. Let's go fly!!!

The only attitude you need is the one that says "you can and you will learn as much as possible from other pilots with more flight/life experience than you."

Times have changed. The train is leaving the station. There is no need to waste years as a CFI unless you want to / like to teach. I would consider being a career CFI but only at the larger asian flight academies in California. If I did it would be for a career and not as a stepping stone.

-LAFF

500 hrs
 

I agree with most of what has already been said.

As a potential ATP student of the 60-day PP program & the 90-day ACPP, I plan on instructing for at least 6-9 months after my initial training. Given the average number of hours that one is able to accrue at the JAX facility or a 90-day ACPP facility, I stand to have approximately 700-1000 hours of TT, with...say...about 400-700 of that being ME time.

I also believe that a person's age, past work experience, and interpersonal skills & abilities are all factors that will contribute to their overall success.



atp

Only you would say time as a CFI is a waste. It is far from it, and personally I still believe everyone should at least try giving a few hundred hours of dual given, it will change and educate you.

I would never go straight from school to 121, but I would like to get to CFI as soon as I could. I'm 30, have about 100TT, and don't have much free time to be at school looking for safety pilots and flying SE A/C. Even with flying at my FBO, which doesn't have any ME A/C, I would still spend about 25-30K getting my ratings. It's basically twice that much at ATP and it's ME time. I have been working since I was 13, and have been humbled over and over again, so I am actually looking forward to getting in the cockpit and learning from my CA. I know there are many pilots that say this and that about ATP, but from what I am reading, the bottom line is how the low timer carries himself and soaks up information, not really the school they go to. I would probably end up instructing for a while anyway because I don't want to commute, so I would wait until a certain regional picks me up. Since this is a career and not a joyride, I would never accept a position from one of "those" airlines. Thanks for the input, guys.

Good Luck Leo, and I agree that ATP can be a good thing for many people, but you are very correct in saying that it is how you carry yourself, and soak in the information that you've learned. I definately don't blame people for wanting to get accelerated ratings, there's nothing wrong with them in their own right, but problem is, is the personal limitations for those pilots haven't been fully learned in that short period of time.

I would never sway anyone from coming to aviation. Reason is, it's a dream for many people. It can be attainable, and sometimes it's going to take a lot of effort and luck for folks to get into flying, either professionally or just for kicks. I love sharing that dream with all of my students, family, and friends!!!!

Exactly what I've been saying in my own pointed way for months on this board.

There is nothing wrong with accelerated training. A lot of it has to do with the person. Its like that in all aspects of life.


-LAFF

Remember that if you come to ATP for your first lesson, odds are your instructor had 0, that's right, 0 hours of flight time 6 months ago. Hopefully you can learn from his experience (or lack thereof)

When you say "come", does that mean that you work there?