Corporate to Airline Pilot job.
 

Hey gang. I am a current part 135 single pilot King air 200 Cap. Sic Citation 135. 2000 hours king Air pic or so.2600 tt.. 300 jet sic. ATP. Never busted a ride. Always wanted to fly airlines. I am 43.In shape and fun to be on trips with. Just a High school ed. Did some college wasn't for me. I am a very safe pilot that can think under pressure. Credit rating sucks but from old college loan.Fixin that. Talk to me. Looking to make a move. :)

Drivin a King Air and Citation...stay where youre at. Presumably you like flying, stay there and keep enjoying it. Don't come to an airline and end up hating flying.

If you're already rich, do what all rich people do... whatever catches your fancy.

But if money will be an issue between the ages of 43 and 65, I would recommend the following three step process:

1) Stay put and fly your King Air and Citation.

2) Don't go to a regional.

3) Wait for the hiring wave and go straight to the first major to hire you.

OK, maybe that's only two steps.

This...
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Hi Bandito,

I figured I'd jump in here since all the replies you've received so far were the usual empty bandwidth.

First, why do you want to head to the airlines? Are you still gainfully employed with your current gig? Do you have a pretty good future there? What are your long term goals?

I have a similar background to you... I used to fly King Airs for a 135 op, and more recently was a part 91 citation co-captain with about 2100 hours. A few months ago I made the switch to a regional airline, as I was only flying about 200 hours/year and did not see a strong future at my corporate gig. I saw the regionals as a place to quickly get my TT up to the "magical" 3500 TT dictated by Wavern/Argus for a lot of the better 135 jet jobs, as well as some of the mid-size jet insurance requirements for part 91 operators.

Additionally, I felt now was my one chance to try the airlines before settling down in life (I'm currently 34, single, no kids). I've only been doing this for a short while, but so far it has been enjoyable. The first year pay is obviously terrible, but as long as you plan ahead financially it is certainly possible to still have fun without incurring debt. It's pretty nice not being tied to a phone on my hard days off, and I'm enjoying the variety of crews that I fly with.

I'm not really sure how far I'll pursue this airline thing, but it will always be a nice boost in my resume if I decide to head back to charter or corporate down the road later. Having exposure to multiple types of operations is always a good thing in my opinion!

One last comment... Since you don't have a college degree, you will most likely be unable to move onto the major airlines/cargo carriers. That's not necessarily a bad thing, as making a career at some of the better regionals is not uncommon. But if your goal is to be flying a Boeing 767 for Delta for example, you might need to reconsider. But you probably already know this.

Good luck with your decision, and please feel free to PM me if you have any questions! Also, keep in mind the most bitter airline pilots are the ones that have never had to slug it out in the crappy charter/corporate jobs. They're kinda clueless! :)

WRX,
You do know that the clueless bitter airline pilots can see your posts, right?

Yes, first year pay is terrible when you're 34 with no kids. So is year 8 pay with a family. Since Bandito didn't reveal his family situation you may not want to tell him it's "certainly possible" to get by.

Please feel free to share your opinion based on your months as a regional pilot. But don't call me clueless, bitter, and empty just because I offer my opinion based on my 8+ years as a regional pilot.

The only hurdle I see with you moving to the airlines is your lack of a college degree. The merits of whether they should or should not be required can be debated elsewhere, fact of the matter is most major/legacy carriers require it or at least the VAST majority of their new hires will have a degree. Many regional carriers would prefer you to have a degree.

Beyond that, 121 is a totally different world than you are use to, there are good and bad things depending on what type of flying you like to do and what sort of work schedule you like. Good luck down the road.

If you presently enjoy a job which pays well and has decent job security, I would stay put. Flying is flying.

Lol. It amazes me how many pilots drop out of college to become pilots. These same pilots then argue that flight training is harder than getting a degree.

Regional airlines do not care if you have a degree. Majors do, but I know at least one pilot at Southwest without a degree and at least one pilot at Delta without a degree (he flowed up from Compass). It is possible to get to a major without a degree, but not probable. Good luck to you.

Yep. What's your point? Did I hurt your feelings?

Well, let's not pick and choose what I said here. I stated he could get by if he "planned ahead financially". That would of course take into account things like expenses from a family, mortgage payment, boat payment, country club dues, etc.

I'm basing my opinion on my years spent in charter and corporate. Some (notice I never said all) airline pilots are "clueless" when they act like those areas are the best thing ever, and tell the OP not to even bother looking at the airlines. They have no idea what his situation is, which is why I was the ONLY one to even ask him questions.

By the way, if you're so ****ed off about the airlines, why don't you get out and do something else? There are other opportunities out there, it's not worth staying somewhere and hating your job. I've been there, and it's not fun.

Because it's much easier to discourage than encourage people to enter the industry. Too many people lose sight of how it felt when they first joined and how excited and proud they felt.

Also if he catches this hiring wave right and does make the regional a career, it could work out pretty good. Yes not having a degree will stop him from the majors but if he so chooses there is still time to finish that.

If the airlines are really where you want to be and you and your family are financially secure (wife works, investments, savings, etc) then do what makes you happy. There are too many jaded A-holes out there that won't hesitate to try to smash your dreams because things didn't work out the way they wanted. Good luck to you.

Bandito,

First off, there's a lot of opportunity out there right now if you are looking to get a taste of what the airlines have to offer. If you are in the position to make the move to a regional, and it is something you have always wanted to do, then go for it. From an outsider's perspective, it seems like if you know the "secret corporate handshake" and have a lot of prior experience, it is relatively easy to get back into that type of flying. That being said (and to Boomer's point), airline flying loses its luster quickly. However, it is still challenging and rewarding, and (in my opinion) beats a 9-5 job.

Also, there's a lot of other career options out there besides flying a 767 for Delta. For example, I fly for an ACMI/Charter airline (121 supplemental), and work with a lot of ex-corporate folks. It feels like an airline/corporate hybrid: One day you can fly a scheduled passenger subservice, the next day you can fly some soldiers half way around the world, and the next trip could be a sports team charter or a big-name band on tour.

Oh, and they even let you fly a big airplane without a college degree...

Good luck, and if you do make the jump, keep your eyes and ears open for all the interesting options that present themselves in this industry. My career path has not taken the path that I thought it would, but it has been more rewarding than I ever thought possible. And after 6 years in the industry, I still really love coming to work.

Nice to know some people still love what they do.

I would not recommend anyone who is in a stable flying job, getting Turbine PIC, to leave for the regionals unless money is not a concern in their lives.

If money is a concern, I suggest a person in that position wait until a non-regional (read: major, legacy, LCC, startup, whatever you want to call it) airline job is available.

I believe my post conveyed those suggestions. If that makes me sound bitter and ****ed off, then maybe I just can't type very well.

I don't think you come across bitter per say Boomer. All you're trying to do is give your opinion. I know a lot of regional pilots who feel the same way. Your view point is very valid. You're just trying to emphasize that quality of life or pay is a factor in the decision. Some people have a more positive outlook. There isn't a right or wrong answer for his question. There has been a lot of information given for the subject. And in the end only he (Bandito in this case) can determine what's best for him. You have to respect your candid honesty here. It's not always greener grass on the other side of the fence so to speak.

Okay, you asked for opinions, and I will give you mine.

A bit of background on me: did the 135 stuff for 8-9 years, corp for 1, am 46, single, no kids. I left the 135 world about six months before I would have lost my job due to my employer's shrinkage. I came to what was at that time a "bottom feeder" regional. Since then, I have upgraded, gotten a decent contract, can hold a decent line, and have as much job security as anyone can have in aviation. I am quite happy being a "lifer" at my regional because I don't want to go back to being the FNG with no seniority even if I will make more.

First off, why do you want to go to the airlines? Travel benefits (not what they used to be)? Better overnights (maybe, but probably not until you get to the mainline)? Better pay (at a regional, you would need to be about a 4-6 year captain to make what a King Air CA usually makes)?

So, you are 43 and have no degree. The lack of a degree pretty much prohibits you from going to a major (there are exceptions, but in general, you are stuck). As a regional FO, you will make far less that you make now, and upgrade times range (realistically) from 3+ years to 5 years (with some companies approaching infinity). So, for the sake of argument, you go to a regional, spend 4 years in the right seat, then upgrade. Now you are 47, probably still have no degree (junior FOs don't have much time for school), and are just getting back to what you earned in the King Air. A year or two and you should be able to hold a decent line. Life is pretty good especially if you live in base. You now have the choice of staying at the regional or, if you have gotten your degree, going to a major...... and going back to the right seat and crappy schedules.

The advantage of an airline is you have hard days off. The disadvantage is you may have to commute, or if you live in base, your base may be closed. Admittedly, if your base is a hub, the odds are better that it won't close.

I don't know what your current schedule and on the road time is. At a regional, unless you live in base, you better figure on four days away and three days off. As a junior guy, those three days might mean you only have one day at home due to the commute. As a senior guy, you could actually be at home all three days.

I know being on call sucks, but if you are working for a decent company with a reasonable schedule, the odds are you are better off there that at a regional. Another benefit to 135 is when you lose your job, you can find another with comparable pay a QOL, whereas in the airlines, you go back to square one.

So, the short answer is this: unless you REALLY hate your job, I would stay put.... but keep looking for other 135 or corporate jobs. The 135 guys I know are on average happier than those who switched to a regional. Especially the over 40 guys.

If I were still in the 135 world, I would probably stay there. Were I to lose my job now (Saab CA), I would probably go back to 135. I had no turbine or jet time before I cam to my regional, but now I do. And I know I could find a "better quality" 135 job now.

If you DO go for a regional, chose one you could be happy retiring from (average or better contract and a big base where you want to live). Just like marriage, there are no guarantees, but at least you will have made a bet with the odds in your favor.

Good Luck,
j

FlyJSH has provided some good advice relevant to your situation.

The big variables are finances and spouse/kids...if you have them, the first few years at a regional are going to be bad news unless the spouse has a good (and portable) job.

Good post FlyJSH, that's exactly the kind of input we need around here.