Purchasing property in Hawaii
 

Hawaiian is hands down my first choice for my career. I am doing all I can professionally to build my qualifications as a pilot - currently a regional Captain, but I want to figure out how to stand out otherwise. I figure buying a 'cheap' condo might help show how serious I am. If for some reason HAL doesn't call, I still travel to the islands often and a place to stay / airbnb out isn't a bad deal for me. I have spent fourteen of the last fifteen years in the SF bay, and what I can get for a dollar on the islands is better than anything in the bay, so if I'm going to invest in property, might as well be Hawaii. COL is technically lower (by 1 whole percent).

Thoughts? Better ways to stand out?

I had considered getting a job flying the Dash at one of the Island private dash operators, but was told sticking where I am now is the better choice.

I thought you couldn’t buy unless you’re a resident.
But I’ve been wrong before.
Some restrictions on real estate ownership though.
I know that much.

You can buy in Fee Simple, which is how I'd want to buy anyway.

What they have is not uncommon. Fee Simple for most property (which is what you think of when buying property) and leaseholds for the rest. For example, in Palm Springs, if you buy on any of the Native American land, it is not Fee Simple, it's a Leasehold. Cheaper but you don't actually own the land, just the improvements. And you renegotiate the contract every X years, so buying a leasehold that is coming up for renegotiation can be risky. A foreigner can't buy a leasehold, but those aren't that common in Hawaii.

The only restriction is the price.
You can get older one bedrooms in town for about $300k+.
Careful of the lower prices, the neighborhoods may not be where you want to live.

Do you need a place to use as just a rental property to show your address as Hawaii? Seems like a lot of work, to buy a condo just for a potential job. I'd make sure that it would be in your benefit to own and or make a profit from your investment.

In Hawaii, you must be kidding! The only thing you need is money. You don’t have to even be a US citizen let alone a resident of Hawaii.

Absolutely don’t need a Hawaii address to apply and get selected for an interview. Given the schedules on the 321, general lack of movement on the seniority list and probably being in the tail end of the recruitment drive (PLUS the insane first year pay) one would think you wouldn’t have that much competition...

When does the attrition start increasing over there?

2020...Maye between 2-3% per year.. some years up to maybe 25 retirements, other years 15 or so... Think I was looking at moving up 100-110 numbers in the next 5 years.

HAL retirements over the next 10 years......


2019: 4
2020: 13
2021: 11
2022: 21
2023: 20
2024: 18
2025: 20
2026: 30
2027: 27
2028: 29
2029: 23

Projected total pilots on property September 1 2019: 829

Lol. I know that much. Lol.
Hawaii ain’t Mexico. A resident? Dude, Hawaii is America. Lol....:rolleyes:

871 pilots on property by Dec 2019

Attend a job fair or three. Worked for someone I know who lives in Houston with no Hawaii connections to speak of.

Does anyone know how many pilots Hawaiian will have total when the expansion stops? Assuming no further options are taken with the NEO.

It's the US. Same as any other state. One exception...

If you want to do improvements in some locations, let's just say permits are harder to obtain if you're haole.

No internal recs?

Was wondering the same. By the time all NEO’s are on property we will have to start hiring for the 787 training bubble as well if not sooner. We would have to be pushing 1,000 within the next few years I would assume. Maybe that’s just my wishful thinking though.

100% accurate. Let’s just say the west coast of Oahu for example...

None. Two job fairs. Few thousand hours TPIC and a high level ALPA position.

The whole USA isn’t like this. You can’t buy property in Saipan unless you’re native by blood. That’s why they’re residents and not citizens.

Saipan is not a state. It would be unconstitutional for a US state to deny the right to purchase real estate to a citizen of another state.

Article 4 of the US Constitution “The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.”

It sounds like some people are conflating purchasing "leasehold" properties vs simple outright purchase.

In Hawaii, many properties are sold as "leasehold" because the department of Hawaiian Homeland Trust (and sometimes other entities) are the owner of the land and manages much of it via "leasehold" titles. This is relatively rare in the contiguous states and most centers around Indian reservations in the contiguous states.

In Hawaii, it's managed as leasehold because many of the trusts forbid selling the property, and the trustee uses the lease fees as income for the trust while always owning the asset. In Hawaii it's sometimes confusing because the Hawaiian Homeland Trust is a quasi governmental organization supposedly managing the trust for the benefit of Native Hawaiians.

There is no "Native Hawaiian" provision to purchasing a leasehold, and many of the leaseholds have a near perpetual renewal provision making the effective ownership rights nearly identical. Leaseholds that do expire can sometimes cause issues when trying to obtain a mortgage for the property, especially if the leasehold is shorter than the proposed mortgage term.

My aunt and uncle bought a condo, and retired in Waikoloa Village, on the Big Island. They love it! It is easy for them to fly to HNL when they need to...

Waikoloa is pretty amazing! I love the Hilton there actually, like 9 pools, including sandy bottom ones for the kids. A natural lagoon with turtles always hanging out. Like 60 acres, you can ride the boat, tram or walk between buildings that have all kinds of Ming Dynasty art work that were put into the hotel when it was built.

Do the night Manta Ray dive right off the coast there (although you depart in Kona Harbor), and I've done it as a night dive and snorkel and prefer the snorkel as the manta come from the depths and scoop up the krill that are attracted by the light arrays the tour companies lie on the sea floor. The dive you end up looking up the whole time which I found uncomfortable. On the snorkel your in perfect position to see the action.

Went to a luau there once when the kids were young. Had a brother in law that lived there in the Village. Cool place.

Actually common enough for park land cabins. Cabins are allowed on some park lands but the land is still owned by the government, and the lease is for a finite period. Sometimes the land is reclaimed at the end of the term, more often renewed.

You are referring to the Hawaiian Home Lands program. It is very limited and restrictive.
Most single family houses by far are fee simple. Condos are a mix, most are fee, but not all. Even a particular building which is owned by an entity may have some fee and some leasehold units, or all leasehold. Terms vary and some offer the fee interest for sale, some don't.

We have one grandfathered in near Tahoe on federal land. We have to graze a certain number of cattle every year to maintain the grandfather clause. We don’t own nada. They would take this back in a nanosecond if they could. Thank god california used to be a red state.

In general, Leaseholds in Hawaii deal with condo's if you are looking for an investment or primary residence.

You can normally buy these for more than $100k less than traditional Fee Simple condo's in the same area.

Typically a poor resale investment unless you are in the retirement age and aren't worried about when the lease is up on the building and land. Leasehold's are often on the market much, much longer than Fee Simple properties. Sometimes years.

When I am browsing for investment property in Hawaii, if I see a beachfront condo going for something really low like $300-$350k, it's almost a guarantee it's a leasehold.