Hawaiian questions.
 

I've been looking through a bunch of the old threads and finding little bits of info that I'm trying to piece together. Can some of you Hawaiian guys/gals chime in on some questions?

What are the min days off on reserve vs line holder?
What are the reserve call out times and report to airport times?
I've heard you can group all your reserve days together to help commuters. How well does this work?
Are there crash pads in HNL?
Have pay rates been agreed for the NEO?

Thanks in advance. Trying to get a good clear picture because of I were lucky enough to get a job it would be a BIG move.

12 days off either way. 2 or 4 hour call outs.
May group days, but may not be awarded if low in seniority.
Yes for crash pads.
Commuting sucks, I would recommend going elsewhere to avoid a 6 hour commute multiple times a month, management at other airlines seem to be more people friendly towards labor.
Neo rates are in an loa, new contract will set new rates.

Hawaiian questions.
 

I would say crashpads maybe. There are a couple that I know of, but there is a waiting list to get in them. I'm not sure how long that's going to take. Rent, housing and PARKING out here is about what you would pay in Manhattan. Odds are very good you're going to need a car out here too.

Also, it's a 5 to 6 hour flight out here and we have no commuter language in our contract. I'm starting to think we will never get commuter language in our contract. It's just not a priority for all of the guys that got hired here 20 years ago, and were able to buy their houses at 20% of what they're going for today.

Your could buy a house at 75% of today's value about 6 yrs ago...

In the last year or two I haven't heard a single person say "we need a commuter clause or it's a no vote for me".. Alhough one of our negotiators lives about as far away from HNL as you can get, so ya never know..

Hawaiian questions.
 

Based on his bidding seniority, I doubt it's a priority.

Six years ago, we had a Seattle base. Property in HNL was the last thing on a lot of people's minds. I fell for that one too. [emoji41]

Unfortunately for a lot of us, even with a commuter clause I would probably never commute that far. ( just personal reasons) It would be down my list of priorities. Aqnd even if I did end up commuting somehow, if I couldn't get there it would be a quick sick call and back home for 3 days.

The fix is a true industry contract with pay where you could afford to buy in HNL and work rules where you have time off to enjoy the islands.

This whole working for 30% less than our peers in an only base option where the cost of living is 30% more than most of the CONUS has GOT TO GO!

If not now, when???!!!

Amen....


And to add to it, I could not consciously vote for something that undermined the work of pilots at other unions. Heard from someone that ALPA is watching our negotiations with interest because there is a fear we may undermine the big 3. I hope not

Any word on how negotiations are going? Are the 321neo rates published somewhere in the contract, couldn't find them in the copy I have, was it a loa?

They are in the 'narrow body aircraft' LOA.
Top of scale for our past amendable date agreement is 188.64/hr 12 yr CA.
PM me if you need help finding it, lots of info there.

321 rates are in a LOA. Not impressive.

We're in mediation with the NMB. Management is playing straight out of the 1990s Management playbook which is try to drag things out as much as possible when times are good, hoping things will take a downturn. This could be done in four months, it could go another year and a half.

So far, the pilot group is holding strong. The days of the airline getting pilots at a 20% to 30% discount while they pay market rates for everything else, coming to an end. We fly the same fleet type to the same type of destinations that Delta does. It's time for a true industry contract.

IMHO, the longer management drags things out, the more our price is going to go up with all of the other carriers signing good contracts.

I may have an old copy. What is the general consensus among the pilot group for bidding for it? Are pilots wanting to bid it vs the 330 or 717? Its a two year seat lock correct?

I'm not sure if you've seen the letter yet, but I recently read Capt. Robert Mix's well thought out and analytically written email. I highly suggest everyone in the pilot group to read it as well. Hopefully the majority of the group can unite and stand fast to fight for an equal contract!

Apologies if this questions has been already been asked, but does Hawaiian allow any conversion for military sorties like other airlines, or do you just list straight time?

AMEN!!!! A MUST read for all.

I converted my times and explained my rationale in the interview. If I hadn't brought it up, I don't think they would even have asked about my times at all. I think I used .2 per sortie.

Another question: based on the $36/hour rate first year, and I would imagine zero daily per diem for the "home every night" inter-island 717 flying, is it even possible to even make $30,000 the first year?

Can you drop trips and pick up other lines to get premium pay like some other airlines, or massage your schedule to somehow make more than this in the first year?

Dear negotiations committee members, and Hal pilots, please don't forget first year pay in the next contract.
Sincerely, future hal pilot.



PS. The fact that one could make more at a regional first year, rather than at a "legacy" flying a widebody is borderline asinine. That being said still willing to take the cut for my dream airline...

Hawaiian questions.
 

Deleted. Not worth it.

Just filled in the blanks and agree!

Premium pay, Is that a joke ! You get your own way to Hawaii for the interview and lodging. If hired you get your own way back out to Hawaii and find somewhere to stay on your own dime. No perdiem either. They don't even offer you a standby ticket.

It's simple then don't apply.

I'm interested in Hawiian as well, so please forgive the ignorant questions...

- Is it challenging to commute from island to island? HNL has such a high cost of living... I was thinking the big island.
- Despite the company dragging its feet, how is the union/company relationship?
- How is the QOL, scheduling and on the road? Time off for line holders, hotels, work schedule?

Thanks for any tribal knowledge. I don't make it out there often.

No, inter island commuting is quite easy.


- Despite the company dragging its feet, how is the union/company relationship?

Depends on how you feel about being taken advantage of. If you don't mind it's good, if you do mind it's not good.

- How is the QOL, scheduling and on the road? Time off for line holders, hotels, work schedule?

Our work rules lag way behind the major airlines. Quality of life is way behind the majors. Scheduling for most west coast trips is very tight so if you remain on west coast time no problem. If you stay on Hawaii time they are very tiring. Many are within 20 minutes if legal min rest. Plan on being sleeping by 8 pm Hawaii time and waking up at 0330 Hawaii time to get more than 4 hours sleep. Once on the road, layovers are generally good in terms of flying with nice people. Time off, many line holders hold barely more than 12 days off, reference crap work rules. Hotel standards are above regional airline quality by a bit, behind other majors. There are a few that are downright terrible.



Thanks for any tribal knowledge. I don't make it out there often.[/QUOTE]

So, does anyone have contact info for those crashpads??

I love answers like that. Do you feel some kind of Hawaiian Pride for your low wages?

We'll find out how the pilot group feels after the 17th when the strike vote is tallied. I'd be surprised and ****ed if it is below high nineties to strike.
Picketing in HNL on the 25th.

Nice, didn't hear about the 25th? Did I miss an email?

I was hoping everyone would have their votes in the first day at 95%+.... And the union could have said..."ehhh, no need to wait. Strike authorized"

Sadly, in my little opinion, about 15% of the group does feel that way. The rest of us are hoping to fix that with the new contract.

See you guys walking the line on the 25th!!!

Fully Qualified - Partially Paid!!!

It will get fixed, I'm sure of it. Too many people coming here from other airlines now so the days of 'insulated expectations' are gone. Management is just playing out of a very old playbook, and will understand how out-of-date they are very shortly. Expect a scramble from them either during or just after the early June negotiations.

HAL

I agree, way too many guys here that have been **** on over the past 15 years... We all expect something better now.


HAL management is still trying to dilute the pilot group with young, relatively inexperienced new hires, that will not rock the boat. Hopefully it's too little too late. ( no offense to the newhires here, but for the most part, every more tenured Hawaiian pilot knows atleast multiple applicants with more experience that are NOT getting a call or even an interview)

All of the new hires I know and that I've spoken with wish they could have voted, and are very fired up. Some said they will leave too if the contract isn't what it should be.

I'm qualified and have an interview this summer, and I can tell you I won't accept the job if it's still $30/hr. And yes HA has been my #1 for years

It's more like $36. Don't spend it all at once.

Look at the bright side though. You get to live in Hawaii and it's only twice as expensive to live here as compared the "average" cost of one of our peers hubs. Oh... And it's just soooo commutable.

I'm sure they will definitely accept you after their HR trolls read that post and figure out who you are. Is "2766" part of your certificate number?

Don't show your hand too early, buddy, you can only hurt yourself. After HAL signs their new contract I'm sure the second-year pay will make you forget the first very quickly. Wish I was still young enough to enjoy non-bankruptcy era contracts!

If nothing else works out Hawaiian is the place for you. The way we treat our new hire candidates says it all about how we value employees especially pilots. Not a bad place to start a career, but move on to a real airline as quickly as possible.

But what's the DOH of the junior WB captain?

11/02/2009

7 Years, sounds ok, but you can do much better some where else. Personally, at the rate we are going we're not going to be around very long. Our financial success has taught us nothing. We operate with the mentality we did as a little inter island operator of 30 years ago.

Here's an answer to that Cost of Living Question.



Hawaii again rated the worst state for making a living
May 24, 2016, 7:24am HST

James Prichard
Web Editor
Pacific Business News

For the sixth year in a row, Hawaii was rated the worst state for making a living in a new report from MoneyRates.com.

The website's analysis blamed Hawaii's high cost of living — at 68.6 percent above the national norm — and state tax burden, which is one of the highest.

For the sixth year in a row, Hawaii was rated the worst state for making a living in a new report from MoneyRates.com.

For the sixth year in a row, Hawaii was rated the worst state for making a living in a… more

The top five states were listed as Wyoming, Washington, Virginia, North Dakota and Texas. At the opposite end of the scale, Hawaii was followed by Oregon, West Virginia, Maine and California.

"If you have already made your fortune, then by all means go to Hawaii and enjoy its warm climate and spectacular natural beauty," the report says. "However, if you are just trying to make a living, the biggest problem you'll run into is the cost of living. "

At 68.6 percent above the national norm, Hawaii's cost of living is the highest of any state. Zillow reports that, as of March 31, the median home value in Hawaii is $556,200, nearly three times higher than No. 1 Wyoming's median home value of $193,300.

Hawaii's state tax burden is the third-highest.