Flyboy68

Delta was like this years ago when I was flying for a cargo 121. They kind of gave me a bad taste in my mouth because you get the feeling of being discriminated against because you weren't in the military.

It was so bad back then, when I'd jumpseat, I'd ask them, "So, what branches of the military did ya'll fly for?' Occasionally, one would say he was civilian trained. It seemed like 90-95% of their pilots were former military and every former military guy I worked with was planning on going to Delta.

SilentLurker

Cheap labor and contracts is the goal. Lowering operating cost for its WO compared to the other regionals.

AA Cadet program/WO regional pipelines plucks new blood from the universities/flight schools. These students/aviators are committed to going to AA via cadet programs (Envoy Pipeline/PSA Pipeline /Piedmont Pipeline). They commit. Many of these cadet/pipeline students sign up 1+ yrs prior to NH class at the WOs. Is it valuable to AAG? You damn right.

1. They get a pipeline and projection of commitments to their WO feed, and flow. These cadets are also extremely valuable to AAG for simple projections, and to make wheels spin faster with incentives when retirement picks up.

2. Standardized pilots in the pipeline familiar with AA operations, profiles, and SOP. Pilots flowing from WO have reported that training at AA academy is easier and much more relaxed than initial WO training and Recurrent training. Military folks have a much harder time getting through training and IOE, just learning saber computer system is tasking for military NHs vs WOs flows.

There is a continued push and directive from AAG towards WO management to line up their standardized procedures and manuals even further be in line with AA. Callouts, profiles, procedures, flight manuals, GOP/SOP etc. So many changes have been made, and according to Mgmt emails, will continue to be made to aline with AA.

3. Less lifers at the WO regional, and cost reductions from having a much younger pilot group to whipsaw. A young pilot group with little interest in labor work group involvement and understanding historical context behind our concessionary contract from Comair 2 threats by management to one WO regional, while whipsawing another WO regional to concede for more growth on the backs of its fellow WO brothers and sisters. The later after various negotiation failures, demands for more concessions. These groups will be the future of AA pilots in 10 years. I’m running, and running fast knocking on mainline doors elsewhere, praying and knowing someone will eventually open.

Let that pot simmer a bit.

4. Flow has intrinsic value to AAG, it’s cheap recruitment. It is working, evident with all WO classes are full of young cadets who get flight benefits for a mainline career while in college / flight school. While most go to one regional to fly the “Ultra Modern” E175 jet regardless of base, or proximity to their home and family. Many wait back at their flight school to get enough “cadet seniority” to hold top pick. To each their own. But 4-6 months later start complaining in the cockpit about crappy work rules and reserve rules compared to other regionals. It’s hilarious (sarcasm).

Waborita

Yes, people die, medical out, get fired, retire before age 65, and recently new hires quitting for other airlines. I put the actual retirement numbers from our union website because those other reasons for leaving are not guaranteed every year. Currently age 65 is a guarantee until they raise the retirement age again

BrownDoubles

I wasn't disputing your numbers... Flyboy asked why your numbers were different from the numbers posted on the "Airline Profiles" section of APC. I submit that the reason the numbers are different from your more accurate "today" numbers from the inside is that the APC numbers are/were dated and individuals (primarily) chose to retire early. Hopefully, we can hold off the increase in retirement age; but mostly I feel for anyone who is in a financial position to have to do this past 65.

Flyboy68

Yeah, if you've been with a major for a while and you're not financially able to retire at 65, you're not doing it right.

JayMahon

I work in finance, specifically with wealthy clientele. There is no upward limit of income that you can earn that excludes you from the ability to live beyond your means.

No matter how much you make, the capacity to outspend and overleverage your life with debt will exist.

Same principles of saving and spending apply regardless of whether you make minimum wage flipping burgers or making huge money flying the long haul shuttle to mars and back.

Vincent Chase

Throw in a couple of ex-wives, and BAM!

atpcliff

One of Our America's, and Our World's problems, is that we have too many people who want more money. Some of them will go beyond acceptable limits to get more money. And, others will ALWAYS want more money, no matter what.

In the airlines, this manifests itself with pilots who have WAY more money than they need to retire, with their current lifestyle. Despite this fact, they still WANT MORE MONEY, so they will fly as long as possible, and then get another job after retirement, because they WANT MORE MONEY. Unless they change themselves, they won't stop wanting more money until they die.

JayMahon

You see the desire for more as a vice, while I would suggest that the evil only comes in the motivation behind that desire and the willingness to make moral compromises to attain that money.

In the end, the law of supply and demand exists with as much force as gravity. So long as someone is willing to pay you more for doing a job, where is the evil in accepting that pay? Do you think the world would be a better place if the money stayed in the hands of the airline rather than in the hands of the experienced pilots doing the work?

I don't judge those who are never satisfied with the money they have, I don't know their circumstances. I do pity them, because few can be ambitious and have a sense of contentment.

dera

They are like The Businessman in Little Prince.