Atlas Air Hiring
02-04-2017, 01:54 PM
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 48
"Worse places...."????
Even Connie, the biggest con job of all...as his parents so aptly named him with great forethought..... has produced a better contract.
Amazon and DHL are in for a huge disappointment. This place is only a couple hikups away from declaring bankruptcy due to incompetent leadership, intentionally tanking the company as they finish packing their golden parachutes on Amazon's dime.
And everyone thought Bezos couldn't be suckered......
Even Connie, the biggest con job of all...as his parents so aptly named him with great forethought..... has produced a better contract.
Amazon and DHL are in for a huge disappointment. This place is only a couple hikups away from declaring bankruptcy due to incompetent leadership, intentionally tanking the company as they finish packing their golden parachutes on Amazon's dime.
And everyone thought Bezos couldn't be suckered......
02-05-2017, 07:50 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 744 CA
Posts: 4,772
Originally Posted by Kerizbro
Guys
Why do I have to be a management pilot or a troll because I don't agree with everything you say?
I wholeheartedly agree to any contract changes that would improve the pilots QOL.
If they are screwing around the schedules to bring you down to monthly garauntee thats tough and should be changed. You guys passed a strike vote, where was the strike? From what I read it seems like you all have been there for a while and have plenty of experience. Maybe you guys are ready to move up to something better legacies, fdx, ups...etc
For the lower time guys, it's a great stepping stone, with good international experience and a 74/76 type.
Again not a troll just don't believe in bashing and deterring someone from applying because you are no longer happy there.
Why do I have to be a management pilot or a troll because I don't agree with everything you say?
I wholeheartedly agree to any contract changes that would improve the pilots QOL.
If they are screwing around the schedules to bring you down to monthly garauntee thats tough and should be changed. You guys passed a strike vote, where was the strike? From what I read it seems like you all have been there for a while and have plenty of experience. Maybe you guys are ready to move up to something better legacies, fdx, ups...etc
For the lower time guys, it's a great stepping stone, with good international experience and a 74/76 type.
Again not a troll just don't believe in bashing and deterring someone from applying because you are no longer happy there.
"where was the strike"?? are you really that clueless about how these things work? Are you at all tuned into what the situation between the company and the union at Atlas is at this point? It surely doesn't seem so. Perhaps some self education about the situation at Atlas between Mgt and the pilots and the REALITIES of the RLA (railway labor act) should be done before posting stuff like this again....
Herc
p.s. All the best to my brothers at Atlas in your contract fight!!
02-05-2017, 08:07 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 264
Originally Posted by Kerizbro
man, you guys amaze me.....
Atlas pays $1600 per month while in training, x3 months is $4,800. Then you get your monthly guarantee of $80/hr x 62hrs which is $4,960 for 9 months that's $44, 640. First year is $49,600not including per diem which is probably another 7k.
However after speaking with several line pilots and a check airmen. I know you guys avg. 80hrs of pay per month. So 3 months of training $4,800 plus 9 months at $80hr x 80hrs is $57,600. So first year pay is $62,400 not including per diem and it would be $76,800(again not including per diem) if you didn't have 3 months at training pay.
Year 2 is easily over $100k and you guys still complain
I do not work there. I do not know the environment but stop whining because some other cargo company is paying more than yours. If you're truly that unhappy to be there, to the point of considering yourselves "inmates" why not just leave? Instead you guys come on APC to rant and cry.
No job is perfect, grow up a bit and go to work!
Atlas pays $1600 per month while in training, x3 months is $4,800. Then you get your monthly guarantee of $80/hr x 62hrs which is $4,960 for 9 months that's $44, 640. First year is $49,600not including per diem which is probably another 7k.
However after speaking with several line pilots and a check airmen. I know you guys avg. 80hrs of pay per month. So 3 months of training $4,800 plus 9 months at $80hr x 80hrs is $57,600. So first year pay is $62,400 not including per diem and it would be $76,800(again not including per diem) if you didn't have 3 months at training pay.
Year 2 is easily over $100k and you guys still complain
I do not work there. I do not know the environment but stop whining because some other cargo company is paying more than yours. If you're truly that unhappy to be there, to the point of considering yourselves "inmates" why not just leave? Instead you guys come on APC to rant and cry.
No job is perfect, grow up a bit and go to work!
Here's my numbers:
2013 (11 months)- $44,171.14 total gross including $7,453.46 above guarantee (zero VX trips)
2014- $72,554.18, $10,587.04 (zero VX)
2015- $106,891.49, $38,510.95 (VX as available)
2016 YTD- $81,969.51, $27,080.95 (ZERO VX since August)
I generally try to bid lines valued at 75-80 hours, thus have cushion of hours above guarantee. Unless they reduce the value of my award. For example, if on reserve and due to start at 0001z, but they assign a trip which reports at 2000z the same day, you've just lost 20 hours of CRT (roughly four hours of pay).
02-05-2017, 10:08 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2013
Posts: 171
Originally Posted by WTFover
Here's my numbers:
2013 (11 months)- $44,171.14 total gross including $7,453.46 above guarantee (zero VX trips)
2014- $72,554.18, $10,587.04 (zero VX)
2015- $106,891.49, $38,510.95 (VX as available)
2016 YTD- $81,969.51, $27,080.95 (ZERO VX since August)
My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
02-05-2017, 10:37 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Retired
Posts: 651
Originally Posted by Kerizbro
...My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
62 hours (50 first year).
Flight pay credit.
Time away from base divided by 4.95. I keep in mind that your fist and last days are not complete days. So if you leave a noon on day one and get back at noon on day 17, your min pay for the month will be 77.6 hours.
How this really shakes out depends on equipment, base and the current scheduling fad.
02-05-2017, 10:45 AM
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: 747-400/8 CA
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by Kerizbro
Wow that is a lot different than some of the other line pilots and other pilots here a few pages back. I'm guessing Vx is overtime?
My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
But maybe those guys were counting the $2400 of imputed income that you are taxed on for air travel. (about $400 - $600 in taxes depending on bracket and deductions) Getting to ANC from anywhere is expensive especially because travel will not book your gateway tickets until the last minute. Travel's policy because they know you trip will change. Best I can usually get is a ticket issued 4 days out if I'm on a DHL express trip.
Bottom line, unless you VX, outbase, or are invlolentarily extended on reserve, you'll never see 80 hours from rig.
Cheers! Go Falcons (i'm a Falcon Fan for the day)
Cousteau
02-05-2017, 12:02 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: 747
Posts: 1,290
Originally Posted by WTFover
BTW, first year guarantee is just 50 hours, if you train on work days, you lose pay, if you take vacation, you lose pay...
The reality is not nearly as good as the sales pitch.
8
02-05-2017, 01:12 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: 747
Posts: 1,290
Tell you what Kerizbro, c'mon on over and interview armed with your extensive research and try out Atlas for a while.
Don't know why I'm even bothering to reply to you, but maybe it'll be informative for anyone else who wants to try to get a job here without reading this whole thread and heeding our warnings. Most Atlas pilots, including me, are optimistic, happy people who are simply trying to warn fellow pilots against making a bad decision. It doesn't make sense for many of us to get hired at another airline, advanced age being chief among the reasons, so the argument about "why don't you just move on" simply doesn't make sense for our situation. BUT, every new pilot that gets hired at Atlas is more than qualified to get hired at a better airline. If it is simply the world wide travel or the big shiny jets that you want, go to Kalitta. They do the same thing that we do, but are paid substantially more.
Most of us Atlas pilots who have been posting here for the past several years started out being very positive about the job and the company. We rooted for new hires and bent over backwards to help out applicants. Then, last spring, Atlas abruptly terminated our section six contract negotiations and announced that they were going to force an amalgamation with Southern Air's pitiful contract. If the company is successful, Atlas pilots would probably be looking at a pay cut. Management has announced that they intend to fight with us for "years" over this. This is current the situation here.
Meanwhile, many other carriers who have historically been extremely underpaid, have signed contracts that far surpass our current contract. All the majors airlines, Jet Blue, Allegiant, Southwest, ABX, Kalitta, and many others pay much more for flying smaller aircraft on far less complicated and brutal trips. There is also a higher risk of a training failure at Atlas due to their "non-standard" training system.
Last, with the Amazon purchase of a large share of our stock, the future of Atlas is perilously uncertain. There are rumors of breaking apart the airline into Amazon, DHL, and charter segments. There are rumors of the 767 operation being sold to ABX. There are rumors of FedEx buying the long range routes and planes but not taking the pilots. It is becoming pretty clear that Atlas management is dragging out the contract talks for some sort of fire sale. If you had done your due diligence, you would have discovered that the Atlas executive management team divided 66 million dollars among themselves last year and simultaneously secured significant golden parachutes for "some reason".
Personally, my faith in the leadership of Atlas has completely disintegrated and I believe that they are only in this game for themselves.
I don't have any idea about what your current status is and I don't really care. But if you are trying to improve your situation, there are far, far better options than Atlas.
But, yeah, give Atlas a try. Just don't say you weren't warned.
8
Don't know why I'm even bothering to reply to you, but maybe it'll be informative for anyone else who wants to try to get a job here without reading this whole thread and heeding our warnings. Most Atlas pilots, including me, are optimistic, happy people who are simply trying to warn fellow pilots against making a bad decision. It doesn't make sense for many of us to get hired at another airline, advanced age being chief among the reasons, so the argument about "why don't you just move on" simply doesn't make sense for our situation. BUT, every new pilot that gets hired at Atlas is more than qualified to get hired at a better airline. If it is simply the world wide travel or the big shiny jets that you want, go to Kalitta. They do the same thing that we do, but are paid substantially more.
Most of us Atlas pilots who have been posting here for the past several years started out being very positive about the job and the company. We rooted for new hires and bent over backwards to help out applicants. Then, last spring, Atlas abruptly terminated our section six contract negotiations and announced that they were going to force an amalgamation with Southern Air's pitiful contract. If the company is successful, Atlas pilots would probably be looking at a pay cut. Management has announced that they intend to fight with us for "years" over this. This is current the situation here.
Meanwhile, many other carriers who have historically been extremely underpaid, have signed contracts that far surpass our current contract. All the majors airlines, Jet Blue, Allegiant, Southwest, ABX, Kalitta, and many others pay much more for flying smaller aircraft on far less complicated and brutal trips. There is also a higher risk of a training failure at Atlas due to their "non-standard" training system.
Last, with the Amazon purchase of a large share of our stock, the future of Atlas is perilously uncertain. There are rumors of breaking apart the airline into Amazon, DHL, and charter segments. There are rumors of the 767 operation being sold to ABX. There are rumors of FedEx buying the long range routes and planes but not taking the pilots. It is becoming pretty clear that Atlas management is dragging out the contract talks for some sort of fire sale. If you had done your due diligence, you would have discovered that the Atlas executive management team divided 66 million dollars among themselves last year and simultaneously secured significant golden parachutes for "some reason".
Personally, my faith in the leadership of Atlas has completely disintegrated and I believe that they are only in this game for themselves.
I don't have any idea about what your current status is and I don't really care. But if you are trying to improve your situation, there are far, far better options than Atlas.
But, yeah, give Atlas a try. Just don't say you weren't warned.
8
02-05-2017, 02:45 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 264
Originally Posted by Kerizbro
Wow that is a lot different than some of the other line pilots and other pilots here a few pages back. I'm guessing Vx is overtime?
My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
My question is, I was informed by a check airmen that you guys get rig pay. Which would mean if you fly a 17 day trip you get 80hrs of pay even if you only fly 70hrs?
02-05-2017, 08:20 PM
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Posts: 83
Originally Posted by Cousteau135
You will never see 17 days of Rig unless you start at 0001Z Day one and end at 2359Z Day 17. Lets say your trip is split into two in a 30 day pattern. First day you start at 1700Z and end at 0500Z day 7, 5 days off and start day 8 at 1700Z again and finish day 17 at 1200Z. These are realistic patterns and your 17 day trip is paid at less then 14 days CRT or approx 63 to 67 hours depending on the actual times. (sorry, I could do the actual math but a little lazy right now. Getting ready for the Super Bowl.)
But maybe those guys were counting the $2400 of imputed income that you are taxed on for air travel. (about $400 - $600 in taxes depending on bracket and deductions) Getting to ANC from anywhere is expensive especially because travel will not book your gateway tickets until the last minute. Travel's policy because they know you trip will change. Best I can usually get is a ticket issued 4 days out if I'm on a DHL express trip.
Bottom line, unless you VX, outbase, or are invlolentarily extended on reserve, you'll never see 80 hours from rig.
Cheers! Go Falcons (i'm a Falcon Fan for the day)
Cousteau
But maybe those guys were counting the $2400 of imputed income that you are taxed on for air travel. (about $400 - $600 in taxes depending on bracket and deductions) Getting to ANC from anywhere is expensive especially because travel will not book your gateway tickets until the last minute. Travel's policy because they know you trip will change. Best I can usually get is a ticket issued 4 days out if I'm on a DHL express trip.
Bottom line, unless you VX, outbase, or are invlolentarily extended on reserve, you'll never see 80 hours from rig.
Cheers! Go Falcons (i'm a Falcon Fan for the day)
Cousteau
This place not only needs better pay rates but will have to drop amount of days we are on the road. I can work less days , and make more at just about every other carrier.
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