What would you do?
07-30-2010, 03:33 PM
#1
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: FO
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What would you do?
If you were a CFII with low multi time and had the opportunity to fly for a part 135 charter with a salary, would you take it? The only catch is that you have to pay for your own sic type rating.
This is a Lear operation. Is this better right now than waiting for the regionals to keep lowering their multi minimums?
Thanks
This is a Lear operation. Is this better right now than waiting for the regionals to keep lowering their multi minimums?
Thanks
07-30-2010, 03:44 PM
#2
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Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,945
That depends...
If you pay for your SIC type rating will they guarantee employment for a period of say 12 months? Will they reimburse you over a period of 12 months?
Is the salary much higher than your average SIC lear gig which can warrant the initial cost of the training (think SWA type deal)?
Is there hope of moving into a PIC position in the near future with the full type at their cost?
I would say that unless this is your dream job I would not consider paying for my own type to be SIC on a lear....or any AC for that matter.
If you pay for your SIC type rating will they guarantee employment for a period of say 12 months? Will they reimburse you over a period of 12 months?
Is the salary much higher than your average SIC lear gig which can warrant the initial cost of the training (think SWA type deal)?
Is there hope of moving into a PIC position in the near future with the full type at their cost?
I would say that unless this is your dream job I would not consider paying for my own type to be SIC on a lear....or any AC for that matter.
07-30-2010, 05:30 PM
#3
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Joined APC: May 2007
Position: JS32 FO
Posts: 848
I fall in the Let the Company Pay For It category. Reasons: An SIC rating is worth almost nothing for you, and most employers will pay for it (although you might have to sign a training contract).
That SIC type will get you nowhere with another company, since they will have to train you anyway on their procedures. Yes, you'll have completed the knowledge requirements for systems (for 12 months), but what if you lose this job and can't get another one in that time frame? You'll have to do recurrent training and it will be the same stuff.
Now if they require a training contract or are reimbursing you (which I didn't gather from your post) you could consider it. But paying for SIC training in a Lear is a bad move IMO since you will be a required crewmember and the SIC type rating is worthless unless you're doing international ops. Even then, it's only worthwhile because it's required by ICAO.
That SIC type will get you nowhere with another company, since they will have to train you anyway on their procedures. Yes, you'll have completed the knowledge requirements for systems (for 12 months), but what if you lose this job and can't get another one in that time frame? You'll have to do recurrent training and it will be the same stuff.
Now if they require a training contract or are reimbursing you (which I didn't gather from your post) you could consider it. But paying for SIC training in a Lear is a bad move IMO since you will be a required crewmember and the SIC type rating is worthless unless you're doing international ops. Even then, it's only worthwhile because it's required by ICAO.
07-31-2010, 09:42 AM
#5
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PFT no longer exists in the airline world, but can still be found in 135/91. It's not uncommon for 91 pilots to buy a type to enhance their career prospects.
If you do it, I would pay the extra to get an PIC type though. If the company has an issue with that, walk away.
Turbojet ME SIC would put you at the head of the line for regional employment once you get 1500/300 or so. Depending on your current prospects for acquiring ME time it might make some sense, as much as I hate to say that.
If you do it, I would pay the extra to get an PIC type though. If the company has an issue with that, walk away.
Turbojet ME SIC would put you at the head of the line for regional employment once you get 1500/300 or so. Depending on your current prospects for acquiring ME time it might make some sense, as much as I hate to say that.
Last edited by rickair7777; 07-31-2010 at 01:17 PM. Reason: Corrected SIC to PIC
07-31-2010, 10:10 AM
#6
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
If you do it, I would pay the extra to get an SIC type though.
Did you mean "PIC" type? I'm not sure how that is handled on a Commercial certificate (I'm assuming no ATP or hours to hold an ATP).
07-31-2010, 10:16 AM
#7
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
If you do it, I would pay the extra to get an SIC type though. If the company has an issue with that, walk away.
As others have said, I'd have some heartburn with paying for the type without some more solid guarantees from the company.
Personally, I'd try to negotiate signing a promissory note to the company for the cost of training. It could be structured to be repaid out of your salary with the balance due in full if you should leave for some reason before the end of the note's term, but with the balance being waived should the company let you go.
In either event, I would try and work it out to pay the difference (depending on the amount) between the SIC and PIC type. As others have said, an SIC type is semi-worthless (another idiotic idea foisted upon us by the rest of the world). A PIC type won't be of much value as a low time pilot, but may serve to open doors down the road when you have accumulated more time.
07-31-2010, 10:54 AM
#8
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All good points.
The reason I am considering this is because as it stands right now we (my school) do not have multi students breaking down our door for training. So paying for 15 hours of Pic time and then the MEI ride does not make much sense.
Right now I am just talking to one of the senior captians with a guaranteed interview. This is all I know about the process from another instructor who joined them this spring.
So... inorder to get multi time and an upgrade in about 3 years, I believe this might be the better route given current conditions. The upgrade training with the PIC is paid for later down the line I believe.
The reason I am considering this is because as it stands right now we (my school) do not have multi students breaking down our door for training. So paying for 15 hours of Pic time and then the MEI ride does not make much sense.
Right now I am just talking to one of the senior captians with a guaranteed interview. This is all I know about the process from another instructor who joined them this spring.
So... inorder to get multi time and an upgrade in about 3 years, I believe this might be the better route given current conditions. The upgrade training with the PIC is paid for later down the line I believe.
07-31-2010, 11:36 AM
#10
Eats shoots and leaves...
Joined APC: Apr 2007
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Given all that, I would give it consideration. You didn't mention where you would do your training/type and how much that would cost, which would also be a major factor. I wouldn't spend $31K for training for a $31K job, but I suspect Lear training & types can be had for a lot less.
A lot would also depend on the employer's reputability - it could be a great opportunity or a scam, so beware.
If it is something you would choose to pursue, I would look very hard at getting the PIC type if at all possible. Not because it will be of value now, but it could be later on.
A lot would also depend on the employer's reputability - it could be a great opportunity or a scam, so beware.
If it is something you would choose to pursue, I would look very hard at getting the PIC type if at all possible. Not because it will be of value now, but it could be later on.
