DrPepper

I understand, but at the same time dont come here and give those same guys the impression that they will be doing 3 on 4 off or 4 on 3 off all the time. Some of the trips are pretty bad, you gotta admit that.

Fokker28

I never said '3 on' or '4 on' or anything of the sort. I simply told them how often they could expect to sleep in their own bed, worst case. How many days they might have to work in a row is a different topic. Besides, I did exactly what you described above for the better part of a decade, and still could today...so why shouldn't they see that as a possibility?

DrPepper

Well i'm sure thats what someone is thinking when they ask what kind of trips can they expect. People want to here the truth, like you can expect to work 6 days in a row with 2 days off then 5 days in a row with another two days off. Dont paint a picture of a happy guy going to sleep in his bed and just loving life. Tell them about 400+ hour away from base and the fact they probably wont be able to make much more than min gauarantee per bid because of the way our lines are created.

JungleBus

Whoaaa big feller. First off, no propagandizing on behalf of Compass here. I'll tell anyone who asks that Compass isn't even in the same league as Horizon. QX is truly a quality airline while Compass is essentially a wet lease operation with everything but flight crews subcontracted out and an overriding emphasis on low cost over quality. Moreover, the pilot shortage can only help us get our rates and working conditions up where they should be, so I'm not encouraging anyone to come to Compass.

By the same token, when people ask about Horizon, I tell them my experience there: great airline, awesome people, nice planes, beautiful scenery, decent contract, unacceptably long upgrade time for anyone with ambitions beyond the regionals. Would you really prefer that I stay quiet and let all the newhires believe LaMar's 3 year projection and then b!tch at you for the next 7 years they're your FO on Burbank turns? I fail to see how that helps you....

So far as the actual info I gave him, yeah it was based on my experience, which was 4 day trips with rather few exceptions. You're right, a newhire's experience might drastically differ from mine depending on which airplane they get. The problem is then they're stuck there. Didn't get the jet? Too bad! Just wait 14 yrs and you might fly it as a junior jet CA...

I spent my first 1.5 yrs on reserve where they DO give you exactly 12 days off per 35 day bid period so from a newhire's perspective that's certainly germane info. The 5 day trips in the jet was from a buddy who flies it and was b!tching at me about it all of last month...perhaps he's talking about 2+3's or something, dunno.

Was my info on post 9/11 hiring freeze and how that will affect upgrade times misleading? It was based on the numbers when I decided to leave in September, I don't know exactly what attrition/upgrade projections have done since then. I'd be interested in an update...

ChinookDriver47

The "unacceptably long upgrades" I think are due to several items that both run in and out of favor with the company. First, it says that QXE is a quality place to be if you are from the area and don't mind working your way to the top. In that sense, it is no different than the rest of the piloting community where we are all looking to get into that next bigger and better thing. Second, it says that the pilots are, at least on the surface content with where they are at and don't want to leave due to QOL, or any other myriads of reasons. In that sense, they have found a home and we should be happy for them. For those of you, like me, who have worked in corporate america, 6 years isn't that long of a time with a company if you plan on making that company a career. I know several folks who work for the airline who are quality individuals both on the flight and ground support side who are very happy working there.

The downside and a possible negation of my previous argument is that the pilot group, especially the captains, are lazy and have no motivation to move onto other things. If that is in fact the situation, QXE would be a horrible place to work because, whether one admits to it or not, no one wants to work with slugs and you WILL eventually clone yourself into being one of them just to be happy because, like the above poster said, no one wants to hear you complain about how bad it sucks and you are tired of slinging gear on the Dash.

Nightsky

I lasted two years until I made a lateral move out of there. Great people overall, but unless you want to be a lifer, give that place a pass. And like others have said, the turboprop schedules are hellish.

Lighteningspeed

Where did you laterally move to? If you don't mind me asking?
Horizon sounds a lot like AE.

Nightsky

I went to XJT. That has proven to be a good move for me. BUT! Don't take that as saying that would be a good move for you. In the regionals, it's anyone's guess as to what will happen. XJT's future is uncertain. You need to factor in your long term goals, QOL issues (commute, etc). I will say I'm far happier here, but that doesn't mean someone else who did the same would be also. Best of luck whatever you decide.

Lighteningspeed

I am not contemplating a move. I intend to stay where I am until I move to a major. I am not at AE nor have I ever been. I was just curious why you moved from Horizon. I have heard both good and bad about Horizon, but then most airlines seems to be that way. Sounds like you have made a good move. Best of luck to you too. We all could use it.

JungleBus

Good points. I think the fact that few people move on does say a lot of good things about Horizon, and the fact is that there are pilots out there from the PNW who would rather live and work in the PNW than build qualifications for the majors quickly. Heck, I'm not even from the PNW and the thought of moving away was one of the toughest parts about leaving Horizon. Different pilots have different priorities, and it's great that there's an airline like Horizon that does mesh well with pilots that have those priorities. The fact that they don't leave means it's a bad place for pilots who have ambitions beyond the regionals...but that really doesn't say anything bad about Horizon.

I didn't feel that the long-timers I flew with were lazy in their flying...or if so, a decidedly small minority of them were. I do think that some were lazy career-wise. I know fairly young guys there who had every intention of going to the majors when they joined QX who have lost all motivation to try for it after subsisting on FO wages for years and then finally getting to the left seat. It's like the thought of going through all that again - another pay cut, another lengthy right-seat sit - is just too much hassle. That's their right, mind you. I just didn't want to become them in another 5 years.