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What's happening at Horizon and Jets?

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What's happening at Horizon and Jets?

Old 07-19-2017, 08:47 PM
  #1971  
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Originally Posted by Galaxy5 View Post
For the reason you think it'll help in future negotiations, it will actually get used against you. Strict adherence to the contract is what helps when it comes time to work on the next one. The company makes a note of every time a pilot waives part of the contract (here it's the extra pay, but it could be a scheduling issue, fatigue, etc., I'll try to draw an analogy to illustrate this for you), and when the next round of negotiations come up, they'll put all that in front of the union and say "look, your pilots are fine with the rates as they are now, so we don't need to raise pay." 200% is a short term fix, it's not in the contract, but the more people use it, the more the company can argue status quo (that's the legal term) in the next negotiations.

This is also not a "pay rate" as you suggest. Pay rates are codified in the contract and cannot be raised and lowered at the company's discretion. This is a short term fix and will go (and has gone) away as quickly as it appeared. They didn't just magically realize that your services are worth more. Flight completion at the least cost to them is worth more. They've got some pretty bright folks (with numbers, guys, not necessarily leaders, don't flame) who have done the math and told them that paying 200% now and canceling x number of flights still makes more money than actually paying the pilots more.

A little history on this, 200% existed 3 years ago, then it evaporated. Some guys took a pretty big hit because they made financial decisions based on that extra pay. It wasn't a pay rate in the contract, though, so when it was gone, well, sorry guys. Then we were told it'd be a cold day in hell before it ever came back.

The analogy: scheduling sucks and a bunch of guys are fatigued. Nobody calls in, though, because fatigue calls aren't pay protected. The union approaches the company about improving schedules because pilots are fatigued, but the company counters with "well hey, look at this really small number of fatigue calls we actually have...you know, empirical data. We don't have a problem, so we're not changing scheduling." Call fatigued when you're fatigued, and guess what, that's ammo for several things in the next contract.

If, after fully understanding the implications of picking up 200% pay, a dude or dudette still wants to pick it up, by all means, have at it, but don't expect a hero's welcome when you show for your trip.

tl;dr version: Fly the contract.
Well written...
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Old 07-19-2017, 11:48 PM
  #1972  
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Originally Posted by Taylor814ce View Post
What's the reserve time for Ejet new hire?

Anymore rumors about next Ejet base?

Are there any training gaps/backlog once class starts? Or can one expect nonstop from start of Indoc to finishing IOE?

Thanks!
Look, I think this is the third time you've posted these kinds of questions. The truth is, rumors don't matter. We will not know that until it's public.

The Jungle jet doesn't really have a predictable reserve time line, because it's a new aircraft type to us and we are taking delivery still.

Delays in training will happen. It sucks, but count on it. Save up chive on.
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Old 07-20-2017, 08:25 AM
  #1973  
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Originally Posted by snackysmores View Post
Guys I think we can all trust the Chief Pilot when she said the real reason they ended 200% was because they didn't want to divide the pilot group
That and we are covering DFW for the rest of the month and STL, OAK, SMF, COS intermittenly for you. Adjusted completion rates in the low 90's (up from the mid 80's), we catch hell for cancelling even one flight. AAG must be seething. How long will this go on?
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Old 07-20-2017, 09:53 AM
  #1974  
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It looks like senior Alaska managements corporate vision of treating employees and pilots like sh!t isn't working as well as it used to.

Alaska pilot contract going to arbitration, can't staff your regional, having to pay OO a fortune to cover dash routes..we gave them everything they wanted in TA '16 as well as the last LOA and they still haven't figured it out.
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Old 07-20-2017, 10:58 AM
  #1975  
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Originally Posted by snackysmores View Post
It looks like senior Alaska managements corporate vision of treating employees and pilots like sh!t isn't working as well as it used to.

Alaska pilot contract going to arbitration, can't staff your regional, having to pay OO a fortune to cover dash routes..we gave them everything they wanted in TA '16 as well as the last LOA and they still haven't figured it out.
Oh, but we have ground air carts. We'll be fine.
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Old 07-20-2017, 01:56 PM
  #1976  
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Originally Posted by snackysmores View Post
Alaska pilot contract going to arbitration, can't staff your regional, having to pay OO a fortune to cover dash routes..we gave them everything they wanted in TA '16 as well as the last LOA and they still haven't figured it out.
So, what's the answer? How does this get fixed?
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Old 07-20-2017, 04:24 PM
  #1977  
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Originally Posted by Jonneaux View Post
So, what's the answer? How does this get fixed?
Alaska makes pilots want to come fly a Q400. Offer more QOL improvements, commuter hotels, dare I say a FLOW? (And not this "guaranteed interview bullish!t scam) It's not rocket science. Piedmont has some of the worst schedules and QOL in the industry and their classes are FULL every month, in fact they're so full they've had to stop hiring just so their training department can catch up.

It's been proven that just throwing money at the problem isn't going to fix it. New young pilots want solid and visible career progression.
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Old 07-20-2017, 04:55 PM
  #1978  
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A flow is where it's at. It wouldn't cost AAG a penny. It would save QX money, getting senior captains off the payroll and attract new FO's for free.
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Old 07-20-2017, 05:01 PM
  #1979  
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Originally Posted by Varsity View Post
A flow is where it's at. It wouldn't cost AAG a penny. It would save QX money, getting senior captains off the payroll and attract new FO's for free.
Piedmont has people lined up out the door to fly a beat up 20 year old E145. Lined up out the door to commute to reserve in PHILLY of all godawful places to be based at. Wake up Alaska. You want your regional chocked full of young CFIs give them a guaranteed job at Alaska in 4-5 years. Not hard.
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Old 07-20-2017, 11:13 PM
  #1980  
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Originally Posted by Jonneaux View Post
So, what's the answer? How does this get fixed?
Real answer? Alright, here you go...


Take the QX seniority list, and staple it to the bottom of the AS pilot seniority list. Put fences in place to inhibit junior AS pilots from bidding down and bumping senior QX pilots out of their single-digit bidding power. Do the same for the flight attendants. And mechanics. Hire a few more dispatchers. Fire every manager in the Portland ops center. Save tons of money on redundant administrative costs. Have a real scope clause so a massive furlough/transfer to Skywest isn't an option. Better yet, scope all flying except for maybe a few PenAir Saabs.

The Q400 would be the junior airplane, and as seniority allowed a pilot could bid the E-jet or the Boeing. The line of applicants would be out the door and around the block. Hell, don't tell them this... but you could probably leave the Q pay alone and still have more applicants than you could shake a stick at.


It won't happen, but that would fix the problem.
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