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[Breeze] Airways

Old 02-08-2020, 06:00 PM
  #551  
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working for below markets rates = scabish
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Old 02-08-2020, 06:07 PM
  #552  
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Originally Posted by PilotGR View Post
working for below markets rates = scabish
No it doesnít. Not even remotely close.
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Old 02-08-2020, 06:38 PM
  #553  
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Originally Posted by PilotGR View Post
working for below markets rates = scabish
There is only 1 mortal sin. That word is reserved for one sin and one only. Let's keep it that way.
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Old 02-08-2020, 07:27 PM
  #554  
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Originally Posted by PilotGR View Post
working for below markets rates = scabish
What were JB pay rates in 2013?
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Old 02-08-2020, 08:06 PM
  #555  
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Originally Posted by jamesholzhauer View Post
There is a huge difference between ride sharing and part 121 scheduled air carrier operations. Trying to flex supply/demand with Uber/lyft is easy. Neither ride sharing company requires a whole lot of capital or operating costs, as those costs are mostly carried by the drivers (yet both companies still canít turn a profit and are still hemorrhaging money, but I digress). Also, the capital assets (cars) are dual use (used to drive and make money and used for personal use throughout the day). The drivers require no special training or pay, unlike an airline pilot. A driver can drive the rider anywhere in the local area. A scheduled air carrier doesnít have the ability to flex to demand or routes in real time...flights are planned by 121 carriers months in advance, not minutes. They can have seasonal routes, seasonal bases, etc, but thatís about the extent of it. An Uber/lyft is a last minute, short time frame, inexpensive transaction that can take you anywhere. A last minute Breeze flight from Fargo to Provo (or any other city pair) has only a limited number of possible riders, with a fixed number of aircraft and routes/city pairs that severely limits this sort of ride sharing type flexibility and ease that some are associating with BreEZe.

I do agree that a younger, made from scratch IT backbone and ecosystem will enable a cleaner set of systems, but I think the benefits/paradigm shift you mention are overstated and wonít be revolutionary.

I do see some good potential in the business plan simply based on Allegiantís success and the low capital, low utilization fleet (195) mixed with an extremely versatile, low CASM fleet of A220s.

Neeleman has never had to pay pilots what they are worth due to his timing with startups. This is where I think he might be miscalculating. There will be a revolving door and a lot of training churn, or pay will have to go up. Iím curious, to what extent, theyíve planned for that. After the new wears off and the early seniority numbers are taken, there is about zero incentive to be there at those rates. Itíll be no different than a regional...get in, get your time, then go to a major. He thinks if regionals can staff at regional rates, he can up those just a little and still staff his operation consistently. Maybe heís right. But the talent and experience of the pilots he will get will follow the ďyou get what you pay forĒ mantra so long as other higher paying airlines are hiring by the thousands. They are banking on guys living in base (hence their live in base bonus), establishing roots, and getting comfortable and not wanting to commute to a major...substituting pilot pay with culture and no commute. Will be interesting to see if it works.
Once breeze burns it's low seniority numbers it can likely getaway with paying regional wages so long as it's willing to hire pilots at ATP minimums and if they put in place a pay scale with a lot of steps that eventually after a 3-5 years pay what the allegiant and spirit then aside from people leaving for legacies, if you started at breeze and have a bit of seniority your making what you would be making at U/LCC then they would do okay for retaining pilots.
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Old 02-08-2020, 08:11 PM
  #556  
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They will not open bases in cheaper cities JUST for the sake of affordability to new hires. Thatís just..... comical
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Old 02-08-2020, 09:22 PM
  #557  
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Originally Posted by Dstblj52 View Post
Once breeze burns it's low seniority numbers it can likely getaway with paying regional wages so long as it's willing to hire pilots at ATP minimums and if they put in place a pay scale with a lot of steps that eventually after a 3-5 years pay what the allegiant and spirit then aside from people leaving for legacies, if you started at breeze and have a bit of seniority your making what you would be making at U/LCC then they would do okay for retaining pilots.
Breezeís hourly rate is no where near ULCC or LCC average. Iím sure itís the same for retirement as well.
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Old 02-08-2020, 11:52 PM
  #558  
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Quickest way to the top of the Jetblue seniority list.
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Old 02-09-2020, 06:28 AM
  #559  
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Originally Posted by SaintNick View Post
Quickest way to the top of the Jetblue seniority list.
I know you jest but some early Breeze pilots undoubtedly have this in the back of their minds. No way in hell they'd be allowed a ratio merge though, zipped in with 20 year captains. Won't happen, not ever. Slotted in with 5 year E190 captains maybe, get a huge pay and retirement bump and they'd better be happy with that.
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Old 02-09-2020, 06:48 AM
  #560  
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The place hasn't even flown a passenger yet and you are talking M&A's already? What's wrong with you people!?!
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