Jumpseat Hypothetical
12-30-2018, 02:02 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by Soxfan1
There is nothing in 117 that would prevent you from flying positive space and/or as a dead head AFTER your duty day has ended regardless if you timed out or not.
So that said why would a company be putting someone on rest to do that? This question seems irrelevant to me. What am I missing?
So that said why would a company be putting someone on rest to do that? This question seems irrelevant to me. What am I missing?
12-30-2018, 04:22 PM
#22
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Originally Posted by Soxfan1
Contract may prevent it though....
If it's not, that can be used against you... either JS home or go to the hotel for ten hours, and then DHD on the next flight with seats, maybe another six hours later.
12-30-2018, 04:25 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by Hawaii808
How about a different spin on a jumpseat question. Supposed you are on a positive space ticket and the flight is oversold and travel vouchers are being offered to take a later flight. On boarding it is discovered that two people were assigned one seat. If the jumpseat is not in use would it be ok to offer to take the travel voucher and sit in the unoccupied jumpseat on the same flight in order to accommodate the passenger (child with his family) that was assigned an already occupied seat.
Assumes you were revenue PS, ie ticket bought by your employer on another airline... non-rev PS is probably not voucher eligible.
12-30-2018, 07:28 PM
#24
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Originally Posted by Hawaii808
How about a different spin on a jumpseat question. Supposed you are on a positive space ticket and the flight is oversold and travel vouchers are being offered to take a later flight. On boarding it is discovered that two people were assigned one seat. If the jumpseat is not in use would it be ok to offer to take the travel voucher and sit in the unoccupied jumpseat on the same flight in order to accommodate the passenger (child with his family) that was assigned an already occupied seat.
12-30-2018, 08:35 PM
#25
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Originally Posted by Cargocapt
Help me solve an argument.
Crew member is scheduled positive space home after trip, company paid ticket. Duty day limitations requires travel on following day at end of trip. Crew stuck at hotel till following day. Earlier available flight home last day of trip after duty day ends. Company can't assign crew to fly home that day, it exceeds duty day.
Can crew jump, without using paid ticket on earlier flight (provided it does not affect other deadhead crew). Crew has dutied off and is now on personal time. Plenty of early flights home instead of another night in a hotel for new duty day.
What should happen to positive space ticket. Should company get refund for ticket or is this a no no.
Hypothetical creates a situation where company purchase ticket then tells crew to take any flight they want home. Obviously company would buy worst flight available to encourage pilots to chose other options. Then if paid ticket not used company can get ticket price refunded. Rinse and repeat. This is obviously a no no, but why.
Vague for a reason.
Crew member is scheduled positive space home after trip, company paid ticket. Duty day limitations requires travel on following day at end of trip. Crew stuck at hotel till following day. Earlier available flight home last day of trip after duty day ends. Company can't assign crew to fly home that day, it exceeds duty day.
Can crew jump, without using paid ticket on earlier flight (provided it does not affect other deadhead crew). Crew has dutied off and is now on personal time. Plenty of early flights home instead of another night in a hotel for new duty day.
What should happen to positive space ticket. Should company get refund for ticket or is this a no no.
Hypothetical creates a situation where company purchase ticket then tells crew to take any flight they want home. Obviously company would buy worst flight available to encourage pilots to chose other options. Then if paid ticket not used company can get ticket price refunded. Rinse and repeat. This is obviously a no no, but why.
Vague for a reason.
I think I understand your question. I have a friend who used to work for a home basing cargo company and they had an agreement where if the crew member would jumpseat to or from their “staging airport” the company would split the cost of the ticket with the crew member. So these pilots would regularly jumpseat to work and earn up to $200 for the effort. That would be a no no. Jumpseating home to get home sooner is perfectly acceptable, but if the company is then going to cancel the ticket and get a refund, and is possibly scheduling on purpose to make things inconvenient to force jumpseating, so they can save money, I would say giving them an opportunity to save money is a no no, or at least a gray area and not what the jumpseat should be utilized for.
12-30-2018, 11:49 PM
#26
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
I would. You gave up your seat so others could go, all the seats got filled by revenue customers. What you do after that is your business. But I'd tell the CA what you're up to, so there's no misunderstanding.
Assumes you were revenue PS, ie ticket bought by your employer on another airline... non-rev PS is probably not voucher eligible.
Assumes you were revenue PS, ie ticket bought by your employer on another airline... non-rev PS is probably not voucher eligible.
12-31-2018, 12:06 AM
#27
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Originally Posted by angry tanker
This is the big no no! You have a positive seat bought by the company, and then take the other company’s voucher, and then Jumpseat on the same flight... This would violate a lot of jumpseat agreements and some discounted fare agreements with the companies involved. If you have a guaranteed seat on a flight, take it. Let the carrier deal with the reseating of others.
Not trying to start an argument. I’m just interested in what airline captains would think if that situation ever presented itself to them. I would probably be fine with it as it solves a problem and maximizes the number of passengers getting to their destination.
12-31-2018, 08:37 AM
#28
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Originally Posted by Hawaii808
I fail to see how a carrier would get upset that somebody is willing to occupy the empty jumpseat so that other customers wouldn’t get bumped from a flight. There would be no revenue lost as somebody would have gotten the voucher when they involuntarily get bumped from the flight. Would it be ok for the pilot/passenger to take the voucher, exit the aircraft, and then walk 20 feet to the next gate and request to jumpseat on a full flight that leaves 45 minutes later? It’s the same thing minus the hassle.
Not trying to start an argument. I’m just interested in what airline captains would think if that situation ever presented itself to them. I would probably be fine with it as it solves a problem and maximizes the number of passengers getting to their destination.
Not trying to start an argument. I’m just interested in what airline captains would think if that situation ever presented itself to them. I would probably be fine with it as it solves a problem and maximizes the number of passengers getting to their destination.
To the OP- once I’ve taken an alternate DH home I don’t care what they do with my ticket.
12-31-2018, 10:55 AM
#29
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Our union (Alpa) has been asked this question previously and their response was to keep the seat.
Giving up a positive space seat for the convenience of others may seem like a good thing to do, but it opens the door for it to become abused.
Giving up a positive space seat for the convenience of others may seem like a good thing to do, but it opens the door for it to become abused.
12-31-2018, 11:24 AM
#30
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Originally Posted by lowandslow
As stated before taking the voucher and the jumpseat seems wrong though I’m not privy to every detail of a jumpseat agreement. A requirement of an ATP is “good moral character” (I know it’s widely ignored) and this seems morally wrong. Kinda like legal vs safe. CAN you do this? SHOULD you do this?
To the OP- once I’ve taken an alternate DH home I don’t care what they do with my ticket.
To the OP- once I’ve taken an alternate DH home I don’t care what they do with my ticket.
As far as the OP question, the problem starts to become where mentioned above the company asking pilots to jumpseat into work and get a $$$ amount for doing that to save the company money (not what jumpseating is designed for).
I believe it's one of the reasons Netjets says that if they can't get you home on go-home day that you will be booked on the first available flight (rest period required of course) that you're legal for. The OP's scenario had the company wanting pilots to jumpseat home so they can refund the ticket cost, and so lets say you finish up at 9pm but are out of duty to get home that night... well instead of booking you on an 8am flight the next morning that gets you home nice and early, they could book you on a 7pm flight (you know, because "its $5 cheaper"), well now as a pilot you have a choice to sit around the hotel/airport all day or just jumpseat home, allowing them to get a refund for your ticket.
Would be a crappy situation everytime you're trying to go home, however I guess the question was actually more to the jumpseat agreement part, but I think that was answered well enough.
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