ryane946

Agreed. I owned stock in SWA, just recently sold it, and I believe that the only real advantage they have over other airlines is fuel hedging. They pay $26 a barrel for oil while all other carriers pay $60-70. Southwest has recently been barely turning a profit. What happens when an airlines LARGEST expense suddenly doubles or tripples. ((

Southwest's structure makes no sense. Why does every other carrier have a hub and spoke system? Because the most economical and efficent way to move passengers from obscure point A to point B is to route them through point C (the HUB). Southwest's spoke to spoke system is inefficient, and this is show by the fact that SWA has the LOWEST load factor in the industry (Around 68-72%).

I also think SWA is missing out on two things, and these happen to be the two largest revenue sources for legacy carriers.
1. First anf Business class seats
2. International flights

Now I will say that Southwest is CANCER. This is the cancer that has helped bring the industry down to what it is today. When they come into a market, they lower prices by some 30% to 40%. Lower prices = lower revenue = lower pay and more furloughed pilots. PERIOD! When they come into a market, the other airline(s) in the market must add more capacity to make sure they won't loose market share. This adds to the excess capacity problem.

Finally, why would you want to work for SWA if you had a choice of hiring with a legacy carrier? Maybe SWA 737 captains make more than legacy 737 captains, but the reality remains that you can't upgrade past a 737. As soon as a legacy captain upgrades to the 757, they are making more than SWA. Furthermore, one of the attractive aspects of flying for a living is you get to travel the world... well not with SWA. For the legacy carriers, you can go to Paris, Sydney, New York, Tokyo, Honolulu, etc... But not with SWA. Free flying benefits are better with the other airlines (you can ride in first class and go international). You might have argued that SWA was good because of job security. Ok, but I think what I have said above says they may not be stable for long. Don't be fooled by SWA's higher 737 captain pay. Unless you plan on spending your whole life on the 737, there is no reason to work with SWA.

SWA is cancer.

cactusmike

I hear Paris, TX is lovely in the springtime.

OldAg84

Mom! Mom! Timmy's not playing faaaiiiir! He won't fly the way we do! He cheated, he hedged his fuel- I didn't get to do that! An' he only plays with 737's, that's boring...I, I, I ..want to play with big boy planes that go to neat places....an...an..

I've said before and I'll say it again:

I've flown every single major airline and the best service has consistently been Southwest. Do I like open seating, not really, but for a better fare WITH better service- I'll stand in line. If I want to go to Europe, I'll use my savings to pay for a ticket. Frequent flyer programs are not a bargain anyway- "no that's blacked out...nope that'll cost double miles..etc".

When you will walk into any car dealer and pay 50% more for the same car down the street because they have coffee and magazines in the service department, let me know- I want to watch. I'd probably pay to.

The FAR's and the economy are the same for everybody. It's capitalism.
Maybe Southwest will take it on the chin down the road- but today they've got it nailed.

Frontier85

Ryane946 tells it like it is and LUVguppy is eating to many peanuts. I've been with a Legacy Carrier for 25yrs and have seen the good and the bad times. The upsides and the downslides and SWA and Jet Blue are starting to slide.

SWAcapt

Yes it sure is dismal over here. The future sure is gloomy for us. You guys should just continue doing what you do best. Pay no attention to 'lil ol' SWA because we are so mismanaged that we have no future. Life sure is miserable. I don't know what to do. Gosh, maybe I can learn all about how an airline should really be run from reading more of these enlightening posts. You guys should get together and start your own airline as I can tell that you are as smart as most legacy airline executives. You crack me up.

dittidano

Ryane946, Your thoughts on SWA are just dumb!! Frankly, I think your just dumb!! Hey, SWAcapt; If I were you I would just quit now. It sounds like to me that SWA is on the downhill slope, get out while you still can

Pilotpip

Please answer how a hub and spoke system is better? Because of a point to point structure, WN can have fewer gates at an airport (lowers costs) which also means they can have less equipment (lower cost) and fewer employees (lower cost) which, while working harder, are paid well. Because they have fewer flights at one time, Southwest's employees are actually working for most of their shift while legacy rampers are sitting in the lounge waiting for the next bank. By the way, notice how many majors are outsourcing to companies like Swissport and ATS for their ground handling lately?

Southwest's lower fares are a result of a free economy. People don't want overpriced fares. They want to get there as cheaply as they can. Blame Southwest all you want, but they wouldn't succeed if they weren't selling a product that wasn't wanted. As a result, the legacies need to respond. Do you shop at Wal-Mart? Same thing.

I don't see any problem with staying on a 737 at Southwest. No matter what the pay rate is at another airline, you're still making more on that little ol' 73 than you ever will on furlough. One of United's biggest problems was that they had a number of aircraft types that were flying the same routes. This means that at every stop, you have to have more towbars (higher cost) more employee training (higher cost). And rather than trying to differentiate themselves or lower costs overall, they created pseudo-airlines with different paint (higher cost), and different seats (higher cost) which has failed time and time again.

I've always enjoyed the people that blame Southwest for degrading the industry. They usually fail to take notice of the crappy management that was still trying to operate like they did prior to deregulation, and giving themselves massive severence packages, stock options, and pay raises while the employees take cuts, layoffs, and loose their pensions.

SkyHigh

Yea ! And like Frontier is soo much diffrent than LUV or Blue. Frontier is really kicking a$$. They have the model for the future.

SkyHigh

ryane946

Answer me one question.
Answer me just one question and I will be happy.
This year, Southwest barely turned a profit. They are paying $26 a barrel for oil while all other airlines are paying $60-70. What happens when an airlines largest or second largest expense tripples . Enough said.

Pilotpip

Their costs have risen before, and they've proven analysts wrong before. Barely a profit is still better than every legacy carrier did last year.

Even if they post a loss for a quarter, or even a year they're still in much better shape than other carriers. All of that profitability means they have something that the others don't have. CASH. Even if it came down to concessions as a last resort, I highly doubt that the management of this company would pull a Carty and have a nice little incentive package while the employees took it in the backside. There's this thing there called good will and respect between the two groups which sadly most other corporations don't seem to understand.