Some Colgan Pilots think they don't take flying away from CAL - check this post out
 

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/sh...299#post347299

Maybe some of you guys at the Majors could tell these guys a thing or two about who should be flying under the mainlines name. Obviously some of them think it shouldn't be CAL pilots.

I tried but, they just say I work for ExpressJet and act like they don't poach on Mainline flying like we do. I think CAL pilots should fly our 50-seaters, but to think its alright to fly 70-seaters for CAL is better than a 50-seater jet?

How old are you? 5? Complaining to mommy and daddy? If you have an opinion, defend it yourself.

boring.....

did, but I guess some of you don't care if pilots will fly your routes for cheaper.
Amazing...

do you even work for a Major?

The guy is trying to defend keeping the flying at mainline. I sure hope you don't work for a mainline carrier with that attitude of yours but from reading what you wrote would pretty much answer that question. Guess your avatar says it all: "QUITTER" ...........:eek:

So the point you are trying to get across is that feel you do flying that should be done by mainline and you want Colgan pilots to feel the same about the flying that they do? I'm not sure what your point is.

so your willing to quit your job or lose your job so mainline can fly erjs???

At least the SAAB is a regional airliner. When did Toronto to Houston become a "regional" flight....talk about stealing from mainline.

yeah but does it have to loads to justify a 73? if your not gonna have 100 plus people on the flight whats the point

Sure it's regional, it operates the region of North America.

But yeah, anything over 90 minutes in an "rj" should be criminal.

That's another argument all together...frequency vs. load factor. A lot of the flights I flew while in IAH had less than 20 people on them. Does that mean the Saab should be replaced with a 1900?

Agreed....

Personally, I would be quite happy to see CAL pilots carrying each and every passenger holding a Continental ticket. If the CAL pilots can pull it off, more power to them! If it means the mainline would absorb my company's flying, I would gladly give up my regional job, apply at CAL, and go back to flying 135 while I waited for an interview.

You quoted Phoenix 23684 who said, "P.S. I'm glad I'm at Colgan flying the Saab for that reason, we don't take jobs away from the majors. Can't see a Boeing landing at Del Rio or Victoria, TX." He gets it!

Colgan's entire fleet of four 1900s and 31 Saabs total some 1000 seats with a practical range of less than 300 miles. Oh, I forgot the 15 Q400s Colgan should have by year's end: that is another 1100 seats whose range goes up to a whopping 400-500 miles.*

XJT on the other hand has 30 135s and 244 145s or more than 13,000 seats with ranges up to 1500 miles.*


So if you were a CAL pilot, which "regional" would you see as more of a threat? Which flying would you rather have back: San Antonio to Sacramento or IAH to Abilene?


Too many folks worry about the mosquitoes when the hyenas are killing the herd.




* I have used total fleet numbers for simplicity. I realize Colgan serves three mainlines; XJT serves two and a healthy charter business.

So I feel I must have a say here since someone has tried to make me look bad about my comment on a different tread.

Personally I feel as I'm learning more about this industry that I have joined, that the RJs have really damaged the industry. Look at the days before the RJs, what were the regionals flying? Do you remember when a 727, DC9 or even 73 was consider small jet?
I think the price of oil going up may do some good to the industry, cutting back on small jets / more schedules. Consider this picture, imagine oil had remain cheap enough for the 50 seat rjs to be profitable. I could see a future where basically all domestic flying would be done by RJs with regional salaries and the majors probably focusing only on the heavy transcontinental.
Again this is all in my own opinion. I would love to see more flying going back to the majors with perhaps bigger equipment and less frequencies, with regionals focusing mostly on small feeder routes.
During my MBA I did a case study between Boeing and Airbus, and feel Boeing has it right with their idea of 200-300 passenger capacity planes as their solution to airport congestion.

for anyone who thinks that the regionals are TAKING flying from the majors is absolutely wrong. the majors are GIVING that flying away. they (the pilots) weren't willing to fight for it.(scope) some may have but the majority have voted to give it up. they gave up props followed by 50 seaters and most have given up 70 seaters. except CAL. (who would have guessed that one)

the regionals are not taking anything they are accepting that flying...

Who makes the schedules? Who bought the RJ's for CAL flying? Who gave up the scope? It isn't and wasn't the regional pilots.

Yes, but us regional guys (and I am one myself) have not done our part to bring up the low end. My personal opinion is that this entire airline industry is only going to get worse until we all unify together. How we get that done...good question.

actually become one union with either 1 contract for all or each contract has a minimum year end cost (pay+contract items=$$$) for size of aircraft so we can't undercut each other. that would force management to run the company instead of coming to us for help.

this will never happen though. look at what has happened since deregulation and in particular the last few years. continued falling pay and quality of life. regionals getting whipsawed and ALPA does absolutly nothing. look at the last few years. huge paycuts, lost pensions, contracts gutted and it's the status quo at ALPA and everywhere else.

in the past pilots always tried to raise the bar. todays pilots don't try and do that. they are called low cost airlines and the new catch phrase ultra low cost airlines. the difference between them primarily is the pay to the employees.

you might get one airline to raise the bar but 2 will stay below and look attractive for a quick upgrade. it's been 1 step forward followed by 2 steps back.

pilots don't care about other pilots and they never look at what's behind them. they only look for what's a head of them. this is how the scope has fallen. they don't care about the 50 seaters because they won't fly them and now it's 70 seaters. if they were asked to give up 747/777 they would fight tooth and nail to protect them because they might fly them someday.

like you said it will probably only get worse, to quote metallica "sad but true"

I would like to see all flying done under each airline's colors done by all pilots on that seniority list.

wouldnt we all..... but I fear its only a dream

Why is everyone getting upset that CAL is contacting Colgan to fly 70 of it's loyal thrill seeking passengers.

Remember boys and girls, the customer is always right, even if he/she wants to engage in risky business like flying in a factory new t-prop.

I'm with the colgan pilots on this one, afterall, they also fly the beech airliner.

That everyone is a source of the problem

It's funny you all think people steal eachothers flying. Just hold on to your scope, PLEASE!!! I don't want to be a lifer here.

Well, instead of offering 4 flights a day in an ERJ you make it two flights a day in a 737

That would be the obvious answer. But then you run into a couple key issues that the traveling public demands. One being frequency, being able to choose when they want to fly. As well as convenience. These can cause airline A to lose market share to airline B.

The resurgance of turboprops on short range regional flight is due to fuel costs. Colgan was purchased with the intention to be used as a turboprop operator.

The author of this post would like to make it seem as though Colgan Pilots are "taking" flying away from CAL pilots, and therefore hurting the mainline pilots. Last I checked most of the routes being flown by Colgan were previously flown by Expressjet. So by the author's rationale, up until this point Expressjet was "taking" flying away from CAL.
Both statements are completely idiotic, and I think the first respond to this post was best, you picked the wrong place to complain.

In the end of the day, all the flying done at the regional level is dictated by what the mainline carriers decide.