jack2007

Nope. My eyes are always screwed shut from "Ladies and gentleman please fasten your seatbelt's" to "The captain has turned off the seatbelt sign" parts.

big air

And regarding to Capt Tom: If he has "damaging" information about Allegiant, why hasn't he brought it to the FAA? Wouldn't that be the best way to improve air safety? Or is Capt Tom's method just to make timid flyers more fearful of "targeted" airlines?

bjsmith

PREFACE: I know this is a pilot forum, but I'm hoping non-pilots (I've been meaning to get my license, but never seem to find the time), with aerospace technical background, are welcome. I'm a heavy traveler and former defense (aerospace) engineer, so I've been around avionics and 6DOF concepts. So I take a keen interest in equipment, safety records and general business.

I am a consultant who lives in Orlando, so I flew a lot of TransMeridian Airlines (TMA) and, now. Allegiant Air. My employer is based out of Raleigh, so I'll fly to GSO, among other places. I still fly quite a bit of AirTran (general) and Continental (anything near IAH or EWR), but when I can book Allegiant to somewhere within 60-90 minutes of my final destination, I do.

In general, I love the Super 8 class, from the MD-80s to the Boeing 717 (fka MD-95, even if the part commonality with Super 8 is a bit limited). I honestly think Boeing under-marketed the 717 (marketed at all?) because it came too close to competing with the 737, and now they left a huge gap in their line that Embraer is now exploiting with the E-190/195. The Super 8s/717s can fly through air that even the 190s can't (and even the Airbus 320s as I understand it), which has been a Godsend as I travel to the NE US quite a bit. But that's another story I'll leave to another thread (such as the Technical forum).


There are only two (2) things that bother me about Allegiant Air, neither of immediate concern:

1. Bald eagle strikes near SFB
   
2. Gallagher of fomer ValuJet infamy is the primary investor and chief

Since I fly out of SFB regularly, this is a concern, but MCO, ATL and EWR are a concern in general when I fly anyway, especially AirTran (given ATL's congestion) and Continental (given EWR's issues, thank God I'm not on overseas flights where 25% are low-fuel coming in).

The latter is the only of passing thought, as I flew ValuJet before the reverse take-off by AirTran. But Allegiant Air is pushing low cost, so one has to be concerned with any leftovers in attitude with Gallagher in-charge. So far, I haven't seen any attitudes reminiscent of ValuJet in all my flights.

Both the age of the aircraft and attitude between ValuJet and AirTran entities are night'n day. AirTran shed its old DC-9s and 737-300s (which SWA kept flying until only recently), and adopted the Boeing 717 and 737-800, especially more of the latter when Boeing pulled the plug on the 717 in 2005 (citing lack of sales to anyone, sans AirTran). I just hope that's not because Gallagher moved to starting SkyWest, et. al.

Likewise, the MD-80 is still newer than DC-9, but not "over the hill" yet either. It seems the MD-80 has been a staple, otherwise American and others wouldn't still fly them. In fact, it seems Allegiant Air made changes on their MD-80s well before American and others, and didn't have to "rush them" like AA when the FAA ordered them. I never liked to see maintenance "rushed" by FAA mandate, and it bothers me to consider SWA (who I've flown on once, never again). The only issues I've ever heard of with MD-80s have been low-budget, foreign carriers that do not respect the age of the aircraft.

In fact, in 2007 the FAA also awarded Allegiant Air their Diamond Award for certification/training for 100% of their technicians and maintenance personnel. Yes, that doesn't automatically translate into solid maintenance and work order approvals, but it does mean that Allegiant Air isn't cutting cost on their maintenance. The comments from Allegiant Air pilots and their associates does make me feel like they do take things seriously.

In fact, I see far fewer broken passenger electronics on Allegiant Air than I do AirTran and, even more surprising, Continental -- surprising given that Continental has the youngest Boeing fleet in the air, and AirTran not much older. I'm not talking about the TV or XM radio, but the lights, air ducts, etc... The "attention to small detail" just seems to be better with Allegiant, although it could be that much of Continental and AirTran's fleets haven't had their first, major overhauls yet (being late '90s or '00+ and newer).

I fly 2-4 times/week, have been since 2001 (not quite as much since the early '90s, but still some). So far, Allegiant Air has impressed me. I also like the fact that they run shorter hours and you can see the attitude difference in their staff too, unlike AirTran or Continental at the end of their 12+ hour day (where they only get paid when the door is shut). Just some observations.

Milk Man

The captain and first officer wouldn't allow an unsafe aircraft in the air. Especially with passengers on board, and the fact captain could get violated. Isnt gonna happen, your in safe hands.

ATlineholder

Actually, Airtran never had 300s, they were 200s. And Milk Man needs to learn how to spell.

Chperplt

An airplane had a bird strike... and that's something that bothers you about Allegiant Air?? Dude... Every airline that has ever launched a flight has had a bird strike. Do you think the pilots on this particular flight thought it would be fun to find this bald eagle and hit it?

Do you realize that the ValuJet crash had nothing to do with ValuJet? Contract mx facility caused that and people went to jail as a result. Do you stay away from Airtran as well? Same management team from ValuJet went to Airtran and some are still there...

You know... Driving may be a better solution for you.

lear 31 pilot

I have hit 2 birds in my short career, its pretty common. I guess nobody should Fly US Air anymore.

Learflyer

Jack, you out there? Did you survive?

Globerunner513

I'm a ramper for Allegiant at BLI, and I can say I'm pretty impressed with the maintenance guys here. Last night, for example they were out there with us till about 1am while we were doing our cleaning rounds, fixing every little thing that came up over the course of the day from passenger lights, to a false nose gear indication.

Of course it seemed these things were fairly quick and easy for them, but to me it shows a certain dedication that is refreshing to be around.

As I'm still a newbie with this particular company, I havn't flown on any Allegiant aircraft myself yet, but I would have no hesitations to flying myself, or sending anyone I know with them.

bjsmith

No, no, no, I guess I wasn't clear in my point.

Other than Miami Air, Allegiant Air is the only domestic carrier out of SFB. With six (6) strikes in only a couple of years, I was -- more or less -- pointing the finger at SFB (and anyone who flies out of SFB), not Allegiant. I know bird strikes are not uncommon, but they seem to be common out of SFB, which is where I fly out of. That's the only point I was making, and I should have made it clearer that it was SFB, not Allegiant, that I was pointing at.

And yes, I understand ever since the US Airways incident that the media is doing their standard flocking to a common issue as if it's uncommon. It is quite pathetic.

Sorry, my mistake. I guess I'm getting AirTran mixed with SWA who flew 737-300 and 737-500s until recently until recently. In fact, has SWA retired all of their 737-500s now? Or are there still a few flying?

I understand ValuJet and the reverse take-over of AirTran which means AirTran is essentially ValuJet. And yes, I'm aware of the illegal cargo that was placed on AirTran, let alone realize how many commercial carriers do carry similar types of nominally legal cargo.

But I always questioned how much was known about the ValuJet operations and subconctracting higher up. I'm not faulting Gallagher, but there is still that wonder about him. I mean, low costs do raise eyebrows. I do point out that Gallagher is behind Allegiant Air as well, but neither AirTran nor Allegiant Air seems to be remotely the same experience I had with ValuJet prior.

SWA reminded me more of ValuJet than anything. But I'm not on the ground crew or flying with the pilots. And SWA is dropping (has dropped?) their old 737-300/500s now, at the request of the FAA. I will give SWA some kudos for at least standardizing on one aircraft, like Allegiant.

I completely understand that. But there are always things that even the most involved pilot cannot always be involved with. The illegal cargo that ValuJet was a perfect example.

I know you guys take care of us. I wouldn't doubt that for a second. And I could care less if you spell perfectly. After all, I majored in engineering, and spelling was never my strong suit either.

I've always felt like Allegiant Air takes care of their planes. ValuJet's DC-9s were over 20 years old average at their time of operation IIRC, of which Allegiant is not quite there yet. Now that they are growing with even more planes (I remember when they had less than 20, now they're over 40), they are building quite a fleet. Those MD-80s are solid aircraft as long as you take care of them and, again, it never hurts to standardize on one aircraft.

I feel others still operating MD-80s, like American, aren't as on-the-ball as Allegiant. But that's just a gut feeling.