Bond

Hey relax sparky,

No one is attacking the pilot group. You're right most airlines are in the same boat, the difference is our management is not trying to stick it to us every chance they get like yours. I'm suprised you haven't heard anything about the list since it was your MEC that pitched it at the national meeting. Let me be clear when I say I support your pilot group and for the most part your union in your attempts to better your situation at UA. But I'm not giving up my seat because your executive management team are a bunch of incompetent **sholes incapable of running a business. The same goes for US, and any other airline.

I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to give up their seat, if I got furloughed. Why wasn't this initiative brought to light 3 years ago when things were looking up at UA? HHMMMMM! Oh and by the way, tell me that UA's current financial state is not condusive to more loses and possible furloughs! Can you say that with that a straight face? Everyone is hurting, that wasn't the point I was trying to make.

Again, thanks but no thanks.

blastoff

National Seniority, obviously won't work. I'm surprised no one has talked about National LONGEVITY. No one gets booted from their seat, but the pilot on his 3rd airline will only see ludicrous 1st year pay once. Management has less of a bargaining chip when its pilots can make a lateral move without going on 1st year pay.

jsled

From this press release:ExpressJet wants reverse stock split - Houston Business Journal:


"ExpressJet (NYSE: XJT) would use the split to improve liquidity and help complete negotiations on wage and benefit concessions with its unionized work groups."

Look out Spanky, they might be coming to "stick it to you". BTW, you assume alot when you think someone would actually want your seat. Just flew with a guy from XJT that came on over when we were hiring. Amazingly, he doesn't regret it. At least, that is what he said. Sparky is a cool name. I like Spanky better.

jsled

Problem with that is you would STILL have pilots complaining. Furloughed UAL guys were entitled to jobs at UAX during the last round of furloughs. They started at 2nd year pay thanks to ALPA. I have heard more than one say guys at the UAX carrier were resentful of the second year pay deal. Here are guys flying UAL code, UAL painted airplanes, fee for departure and a furloughed guy can't come sit at the bottom of the list with a little extra pay? One furloughed guy I talked to had to hear about it during his entire IOE from the check airman at Skywest. Said it was miserable.

Bond

Again Spanky (LOL),

You're taking this as an attack on your company (and apparently your person), but your management is awful and has a history of screwing you, and because of their incompetence you guys are suffering and have been suffering for the last few years.

BTW, a reverse split is to assure we don't get de-listed, I suggest reading a little. It doesn't really affect our pilot group. In fact this management has always been labor friendly. But this isn't about mine is better than yours. This is about a flawed mentality to protect the jobs of few individuals at the expense of others. No thank you, keep your list, we'll vote ALPA off property before that ever happens (in other words, it won't happen).

jsled

I read fine. I was talking about this part..."help complete negotiations on wage and benefit concessions". That certainly does not sound labor friendly.

blastoff

Sounds like the problem was a "flow back" agreement without a reciprocal "flow up." I'm sure you wouldn't hear a peep from UEX if they were offered 2nd year pay when they moved up to mainline. Of course, this is an all or nothing scenario...all airlines participate or none.

Bond

We mitigated over 150 furloughs and 50 downgrades because the company sat down and worked with us. We have the best 50 seat pay and work rules, because management sat down and worked with us. We got to keep all our jobs when CAL released 69 frames from their contract two years ago, because management worked with us. What has Tilton done for you guys lately? Seen your pay scale lately in relation to all the other Legacy carriers? I hope you guys get back to pre 9/11 pay and rules, but with that lunatic at the helm and you guys bleeding billions, I just don't see it any time soon.

Again, what about the national seniority list? Why do you continue to make this about yours and mine?

jsled

I told you I have heard nothing about a national list. Have you? other than some forum rumor? I see our rates. They suck. But years at good wages + a nice pension settlement check have kept me afloat. I am just glad I left the regional ranks 13 years ago. At least I can pay the bills on ****ty legacy wages.

jsled

So flying shiny new 70 seat jets at the direct expense of 1000's of furloughs is not payment enough? We are talking about right seat jobs at the bottom of the list. It was a contractual condition of giving up 70 seat scope.