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Southwest may make a bid for Frontier

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Southwest may make a bid for Frontier

Old 08-01-2009, 06:38 AM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by IADBLRJ41 View Post
A great move by WN. Cheap purchase to secure a strong future.

Its 50 airplanes and 700 pilots....not as big of a deal for SWA as it might be for Frontier
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Old 08-01-2009, 06:42 AM
  #172  
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Originally Posted by HIREME View Post
SWA isn't alpa...what's to prevent them from cutting the Frontier guys loose?

Nothing...this is about gates.
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Old 08-01-2009, 06:56 AM
  #173  
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Im curious what more F9 guys have to say about this southwest deal. So far RAH has stated they want to operate Frontier as they are today. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen. Its a near certainty most of the F9 pilots will be out of work if Southwest wins the bid. Its easy for most on here to say the Southwest deal is better because its not their jobs that are on the line. There will be no staple or integration with southwest. Just an interview. So what is worse? Giving up your career for a potential interview, or integrating with a current regional airline and maybe working out a long term fence in the integration?
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:01 AM
  #174  
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Originally Posted by flyguy23 View Post
Im curious what more F9 guys have to say about this southwest deal. So far RAH has stated they want to operate Frontier as they are today. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen. Its a near certainty most of the F9 pilots will be out of work if Southwest wins the bid. Its easy for most on here to say the Southwest deal is better because its not their jobs that are on the line. There will be no staple or integration with southwest. Just an interview. So what is worse? Giving up your career for a potential interview, or integrating with a current regional airline and maybe working out a long term fence in the integration?
Bedford can't keep the companies separate. Fences may be one thing for a few years, but seniority lists have to be merged per our very tight contract. He tried it in the past and it failed and if he tries it again, he'll lose. Most folks at RAH are fine with fences until all F9 guys are back on property and then open up the possibility of movement. A little premature for all this though. A very interesting letter from BB yesterday in regards to SWA...
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:07 AM
  #175  
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As a Midwest pilot, I all ready know my future. Right now, there is none. Republic has come in, taken our jobs that our former CEO gave them, and they did so and continue to do so with a smile on their face. There has been not one date mentioned about training on a new aircraft even though the last 717 will be gone by Christmas. Now I am told I am "owned by Republic". I did not apply with them, I did not ask them to take me. The last thing I expected was to have to go back to the commuters. So you see my fellow Frontier pilots, you could be in my shoes. You could have your career cheapen and your airline and flying experience cheapen to that of the lowest in the industry. That is what our fate holds for us. As for you, you have a chance to work for the most successful airline in the world. I would rather have that chance, than to know I will probably have to spend the rest of my career as part of the problem rather than the solution. I wish all of the pilot group of Frontier well. I have ridden on you numeours times over the years and you have always treated me great. I have talked to you in the hotels around the system and partied with some of you during the holidays. You are good people and like the pilot group of Midwest, you do not deserve to have your lives become part of a "bidding battle". But however this thing turns out, the pilots of Midwest are behind you. We wish you all the best.
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:08 AM
  #176  
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Originally Posted by flyguy23 View Post
Its a near certainty most of the F9 pilots will be out of work if Southwest wins the bid. Its easy for most on here to say the Southwest deal is better because its not their jobs that are on the line. There will be no staple or integration with southwest. Just an interview. So what is worse? Giving up your career for a potential interview, or integrating with a current regional airline and maybe working out a long term fence in the integration?
This is a total fabrication.
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:10 AM
  #177  
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Originally Posted by TillerEnvy View Post
Bedford can't keep the companies separate. Fences may be one thing for a few years, but seniority lists have to be merged per our very tight contract. He tried it in the past and it failed and if he tries it again, he'll lose. Most folks at RAH are fine with fences until all F9 guys are back on property and then open up the possibility of movement. A little premature for all this though. A very interesting letter from BB yesterday in regards to SWA...
You misunderstood what I said. Keeping the companies seperate implies that all current employees keep their jobs and the operations remain pretty much the same. The seniority integration has to happen. A fence would have to be set up. How long and with what provisions would be worked out in the union negotiations. My personal opinion is the southwest offer will be withdrawn. We'll just have to see.
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:13 AM
  #178  
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Originally Posted by flyguy23 View Post
There will be no staple or integration with southwest. Just an interview.
Read up on Bond-McCaskill.
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:15 AM
  #179  
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Originally Posted by FAULTPUSH View Post
. . . I think that Bond-McCaskill protects all employees, union or otherwise, as long as they are covered the the RLA. Here's the bill, on the left side of the page. Swelblog / Swelbar on Airlines - Articles - F + E = LPP^DL: Fairness and Equity; Seniority Integration; Union Representation; and Lee MoakAgain . . .
Thanks for the link. While I'm no lawyer and certainly not a law maker (and I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night), I think this is the key line:

(4) COVERED TRANSACTION- The term `covered transaction' means--
(A) a transaction for the combination of multiple air carriers into a single air carrier. . .

The statement made by SWA EVP Ron Ricks the other day was this:

"Frontier would continue to operate independently and separately for a period of time with its Airbus aircraft and personnel. Over time, Frontier Employees would be hired into Southwest as needed to support our fleet growth and expanded operations."

How do you see that as fitting "multiple air carriers into a single air carrier."? As I stated yesterday I'm sure the lawyers were very careful with how that was worded.

Even the "transfer of 50% of the assets" comments doesn't help here because F9 will still own the assets.

I've seen other posts saying that SWA wants some form of a labor agreement before they finalize their bid. It will be interresting to see what that is and if SWA takes a different position on how F9 employees will be "hired into Southwest".

Keep watching boys and girls, this show isn't even half over.
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Old 08-01-2009, 07:19 AM
  #180  
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Originally Posted by FAULTPUSH View Post
Read up on Bond-McCaskill.

I have, maybe you should. Southwest is NOT bringing the two airlines together. They have stated their intent to keep them completely seperate and to offer Frontier employees a position at southwest when their jobs go away AND there are openings at southwest.
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