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Recall of DAL MEC Officers

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Recall of DAL MEC Officers

Old 10-30-2013, 11:12 AM
  #721  
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Sink, I agree about the dysfunction, but what or who created that dysfunction...I think that's where the disagreement and questions come in.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:27 AM
  #722  
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Originally Posted by Sink r8 View Post
I'm going to let my previous post stand, Nu. Most of us aren't interested in who exactly hunts in what wolf-pack, or what the relationship is between the members. Is there an alpha-male? A Sith among the Jedis? I couldn't care less.

Guys are engaging in alliances, attack, counter, payback, etc. I think most people see it pretty plainly.

I don't care who is scratching who's back, or whatever else they might be scratching. I just care about the dysfunction, and how it's hurting us.
What many of these guys are engaging in is petty BS politics. Pilots playing politics at any level is pretty much like 3 year olds playing with assault weapons in the backyard--they're not trained for it and someone is likely to get hurt. We have plenty of governance--we need a full cadre of reps that will respect it and try to build something, not look for reasons to tear things apart and take the easy road.

Until then, I agree with your statement on dysfunction and how it is hurting us, all of us. I'm ready for substance, if they can't hack it, get out of the way and let someone else do it.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:28 AM
  #723  
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Originally Posted by iceman49 View Post
Sink, I agree about the dysfunction, but what or who created that dysfunction...I think that's where the disagreement and questions come in.
We all hear bits and pieces, but I think the bottom line is too many of the reps are willing to get mired into broad-based and philosophical conflicts. They're not spending enough time on practical issues.

As I understand it, there is also a fundamental difference about whether you give a more empowered Chairman the authority to act on behalf of the MEC, or whether you have the MEC run the committees, and marginalize the Chairman position.

With one approach, you're always in danger of having a dictator step in, and potentially overstay his welcome, or the opposite RedGreen, where you're never in danger of anyone agreeing on anything, because 19 guys are trying to run a handful of guys, with mo obvious chain of command.

Two sorts of political systems.

In my mind, you hire and fire the best people you can find, give them enough authority to prove themselves, but you still don't let them grow roots.

We need good people, with term limits.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:31 AM
  #724  
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I find it interesting that, when confronted with complaints about the bloated bureaucracy at national, the DALPA guys insist that DALPA is all but independent, that the only impact national has on the Delta pilot group is to provide medical and legal services.

Then the Moak snaps his fingers, gives an order, and DALPA mashes the panic button--spending $66,000 of our dues money in FPL (and an unknown amount on mailing pins and lanyards) in an attempt to squash the DPA.

So...which is it? Are we all but independent from national? Or is the MEC just a puppet of the national regime? I think we all know the real answer to that.

At least my trash hauler got a snazzy ALPA lanyard and pin out of the deal.

Last edited by Purple Drank; 10-30-2013 at 12:01 PM.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:33 AM
  #725  
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Originally Posted by Bearcat57 View Post
What many of these guys are engaging in is petty BS politics. Pilots playing politics at any level is pretty much like 3 year olds playing with assault weapons in the backyard--they're not trained for it and someone is likely to get hurt. We have plenty of governance--we need a full cadre of reps that will respect it and try to build something, not look for reasons to tear things apart and take the easy road.

Until then, I agree with your statement on dysfunction and how it is hurting us, all of us. I'm ready for substance, if they can't hack it, get out of the way and let someone else do it.
Absolutely agree with the principle.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:36 AM
  #726  
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Originally Posted by Purple Drank View Post
I find it interesting that, when confronted with complaints about the bloated bureaucracy at national, the DALPA guys insist that they are all but independent, that the only impact national has on the Delta pilot group is to provide medical and legal services.

Then the Moak snaps his fingers, gives an order, and DALPA mashes the panic button--spending $66,000 of our dues money in an attempt to squash the DPA.

So...which is it? Are we all but independent from national? Or is the MEC just a puppet of the national regime? I think we all know the real answer to that.

At least my trash hauler got a snazzy ALPA lanyard out of the deal.
That's a valid point if you can prove your premise. My reps said the MEC decided to take a more active route.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:57 AM
  #727  
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Originally Posted by Sink r8 View Post
That's a valid point if you can prove your premise. My reps said the MEC decided to take a more active route.
See below "testimony" of the then-MEC chairman, from one summary of the proceedings (can be seen in its entirety earlier in this thread).

Roberts: Let me back up a bit. For three years or so we have been told by National ALPA to just ignore DPA. Never put their name in print, never mention them and they will just go away. When I took office, I inherited over 5000 DPA cards. In June, Lee Moak called and said that we need to start doing something about DPA.

Why a Special Committee:

As Roberts put it, to deal with the DPA issue.

A phone call from Moak in June 2013 asked that we start doing something about DPA, according to Roberts.

.....

Reps concerns in discussion with regards to the Special Committee:

Financial:
• LAX stated that it is $66k in the hole, and how do I explain that to my pilots?
• Fries confirmed the Reps reference to $66k in flight pay loss, however never mentioned other materials costs, and wasn't asked.
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Old 10-30-2013, 01:11 PM
  #728  
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Originally Posted by Purple Drank View Post
See below "testimony" of the then-MEC chairman, from one summary of the proceedings (can be seen in its entirety earlier in this thread).
Thanks, PD. This isn't a transcript, but the notes of someone that was making an argument about the recall, correct?

Regardless, if Roberts set up this committee just because Moak told him so, then you've said all there needs to be said about his recall.

I thought the MEC decided to act one the DPA, but I wasn't there.
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Old 10-30-2013, 01:18 PM
  #729  
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Originally Posted by Sink r8 View Post
Thanks, PD. This isn't a transcript, but the notes of someone that was making an argument about the recall, correct?
Agree. I'm only citing it to the extent that there was discussion of Moak's involvement in DALPA's business.

Originally Posted by Sink r8 View Post
Regardless, if Roberts set up this committee just because Moak told him so, then you've said all there needs to be said about his recall
I'm not discussing it in terms of the recall per se. I'm discussing it in terms of DALPA, on one hand, insisting they are immune from national's tampering--and on the other hand, acting as Moak's lapdog.

Are you implying that Roberts was recalled for carrying out Moak's orders?
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