Delta 777 and 747 fences
11-07-2013, 05:23 AM
#2
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
Why? You going to bid it?
I believe the fences come down Jan. 1 of 2015, not 2014, so you've got a year to google the arbitrator's decision and try to decipher it. Something about 'unfilled, unbid slots' will then be filled by either N/S group...but I haven't seen any A/E's to either the 777/747 in quite a while, despite the retirements off of both. The only way in is through a displacement.
I believe the fences come down Jan. 1 of 2015, not 2014, so you've got a year to google the arbitrator's decision and try to decipher it. Something about 'unfilled, unbid slots' will then be filled by either N/S group...but I haven't seen any A/E's to either the 777/747 in quite a while, despite the retirements off of both. The only way in is through a displacement.
11-07-2013, 06:32 AM
#6
Works Every Weekend
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: 737 ATL
Posts: 3,506
Originally Posted by dogpilot
Will someone post the language associated with these fences? Thanks.
4. For the period of five (5) years beginning with the first bid period after the
issuance of the Single Operating Certificate (SOC), no pre-merger
Northwest pilot may be awarded or displaced to a vacancy on a B777
aircraft or category and no pre-merger Delta pilot may be awarded or
displaced to a B787 or B747 vacancy.
5. Should the merged company take delivery of any aircraft which is/are a
replacement of any aircraft covered by Paragraph 4., the captain positions
and, as applicable, the first officer positions on each such replacement
aircraft will be allocated in accordance with the Paragraph 4. restrictions
on the type it is replacing.
6. Paragraph 4. shall expire on the fifth (5th) anniversary of the SOC. Any
bid awards or displacements effective after that date will not be subject to
this restriction.
7. If there are insufficient bidders from one pre-merger pilot group for a
posted or contingent vacancy on one side of the fence during the period
covered by Paragraph 4., unfilled vacancies may be filled by pilots from the
other pre-merger airline.
8. A pilot awarded a position (via an AE, MD or VD) to a category as a result
of insufficient bidders will, for the purposes of processing future
displacements in accordance with Section 22 F. of the JCBA, be considered
as junior to all pilots from the pre-merger pilot group that was entitled to
that category.FYI: The 5th anniversary of Single Operating Certificate (SOC) is Jan. 1, 2015
11-07-2013, 06:45 AM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: 7ER
Posts: 183
Originally Posted by tsquare
Those numbers are totally useless.
747 CA 17% of (11,700)
747 FO 73%
777 CA 14%
777 FO 65%
I think showing how many years on property the bottom pilot in a category has accrued illustrates just how senior these airplanes are. Most of us understand that it's a snapshot and that as attrition, transitions, displacements, growth and recruitment occur the picture will be ever changing. For someone outside, showing relative seniority (I think) doesn't convey as much. To each their own.
11-07-2013, 06:51 AM
#9
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Originally Posted by Tumbleweed
Relative Seniority:
747 CA 17% of (11,700)
747 FO 73%
777 CA 14%
777 FO 65%
I think showing how many years on property the bottom pilot in a category has accrued illustrates just how senior these airplanes are. Most of us understand that it's a snapshot and that as attrition, transitions, displacements, growth and recruitment occur the picture will be ever changing. For someone outside, showing relative seniority (I think) doesn't convey as much. To each their own.
747 CA 17% of (11,700)
747 FO 73%
777 CA 14%
777 FO 65%
I think showing how many years on property the bottom pilot in a category has accrued illustrates just how senior these airplanes are. Most of us understand that it's a snapshot and that as attrition, transitions, displacements, growth and recruitment occur the picture will be ever changing. For someone outside, showing relative seniority (I think) doesn't convey as much. To each their own.
11-07-2013, 07:03 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: 7ER
Posts: 183
Originally Posted by tsquare
If you say so. Of course we have merged several different groups over the years that hired at different times making YOS/DOH a totally invalid measurement. And I would take exception to the contention that these airplanes are really senior. I'll wager that the lowest FOs better hope that they do not get displaced when the fences come down, because none will see lineholder status for a long long time...
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