Jetblue anti-union tactics
#141
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,007
Wrong, I was mainline management during the bankruptcy era, the legacies went bankrupt because of the pension program. They had to get their employee costs in line with the likes of SWA, and the Jetblue start-up for example.
Scope was sold to try and save the pension, it failed miserably.
Scope was sold to try and save the pension, it failed miserably.
So how would the adjustment model work if low cost carriers weren't a factor? Is it ok if a new low cost model comes in and jacks down SWA/JB wages? Why is fuel price ok but wages are always open for negotiation?
UAL went after Canadian pensions too... the canuck govt wouldn't let them... UAL still in Canada?
#142
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Posts: 593
Best of luck to the JBLU pilots with your vote. I believe that having a legal seat at the table is critical in this industry. It's also important to have protections against arbitrary management decisions. Even if you like your current management team, that team can change at any moment.
#143
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
So how would the adjustment model work if low cost carriers weren't a factor? Is it ok if a new low cost model comes in and jacks down SWA/JB wages? Why is fuel price ok but wages are always open for negotiation?
UAL went after Canadian pensions too... the canuck govt wouldn't let them... UAL still in Canada?
UAL went after Canadian pensions too... the canuck govt wouldn't let them... UAL still in Canada?
In other words, you are correct that the business model was flawed, but most of that restructuring was done outside of bankruptcy.
#144
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 67
Could have a union problem at AA/UsAir too. Always union drama.
American responds in pilots union dispute over seniority | American Airlines | American ...
American responds in pilots union dispute over seniority | American Airlines | American ...
3A was drama - no unions involved. Health Care rape was drama (unless you have super secret insurance) no unions involved. Two pilots going out the door with no day in court was dramatic - along with someone threatening an entire flight staying inside the door. No union drama involved here either.
Real drama also comes in any merge - with or without a union. Bottom line - every pilot will scratch and claw for every number they can get. Its just business. Going in unarmed denies the reality of the arena.
#145
Quote:
Originally Posted by P-3Bubba
Could have a union problem at AA/UsAir too. Always union drama.
American responds in pilots union dispute over seniority | American Airlines | American ...
You don't need a union for the drama. Drama comes because this is capitalism. There are tens (sometimes hundreds) of millions of dollars on the table. If you choose to advocate for your piece of the pie without any legal backing you may be able to keep the "drama" minimized. You will most likely have the same effect on the size of your piece.
3A was drama - no unions involved. Health Care rape was drama (unless you have super secret insurance) no unions involved. Two pilots going out the door with no day in court was dramatic - along with someone threatening an entire flight staying inside the door. No union drama involved here either.
Real drama also comes in any merge - with or without a union. Bottom line - every pilot will scratch and claw for every number they can get. Its just business. Going in unarmed denies the reality of the arena.
Originally Posted by P-3Bubba
Could have a union problem at AA/UsAir too. Always union drama.
American responds in pilots union dispute over seniority | American Airlines | American ...
You don't need a union for the drama. Drama comes because this is capitalism. There are tens (sometimes hundreds) of millions of dollars on the table. If you choose to advocate for your piece of the pie without any legal backing you may be able to keep the "drama" minimized. You will most likely have the same effect on the size of your piece.
3A was drama - no unions involved. Health Care rape was drama (unless you have super secret insurance) no unions involved. Two pilots going out the door with no day in court was dramatic - along with someone threatening an entire flight staying inside the door. No union drama involved here either.
Real drama also comes in any merge - with or without a union. Bottom line - every pilot will scratch and claw for every number they can get. Its just business. Going in unarmed denies the reality of the arena.
#146
You don't need a union for the drama. Drama comes because this is capitalism. There are tens (sometimes hundreds) of millions of dollars on the table. If you choose to advocate for your piece of the pie without any legal backing you may be able to keep the "drama" minimized. You will most likely have the same effect on the size of your piece.
3A was drama - no unions involved. Health Care rape was drama (unless you have super secret insurance) no unions involved. Two pilots going out the door with no day in court was dramatic - along with someone threatening an entire flight staying inside the door. No union drama involved here either.
Real drama also comes in any merge - with or without a union. Bottom line - every pilot will scratch and claw for every number they can get. Its just business. Going in unarmed denies the reality of the arena.
3A was drama - no unions involved. Health Care rape was drama (unless you have super secret insurance) no unions involved. Two pilots going out the door with no day in court was dramatic - along with someone threatening an entire flight staying inside the door. No union drama involved here either.
Real drama also comes in any merge - with or without a union. Bottom line - every pilot will scratch and claw for every number they can get. Its just business. Going in unarmed denies the reality of the arena.
#147
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
Snarge, I'm specifically giving the reason for bankruptcy, if they could have shed those obligations outside of it, they wouldn't have gone the BK route. Furthermore, there was a massive amount of restructuring done at NWA pre-bankruptcy. The fact that NWA was able to freeze some of the pensions was a credit for additional items.
In other words, you are correct that the business model was flawed, but most of that restructuring was done outside of bankruptcy.
In other words, you are correct that the business model was flawed, but most of that restructuring was done outside of bankruptcy.
#148
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
Snarge, I'm specifically giving the reason for bankruptcy, if they could have shed those obligations outside of it, they wouldn't have gone the BK route. Furthermore, there was a massive amount of restructuring done at NWA pre-bankruptcy. The fact that NWA was able to freeze some of the pensions was a credit for additional items.
In other words, you are correct that the business model was flawed, but most of that restructuring was done outside of bankruptcy.
In other words, you are correct that the business model was flawed, but most of that restructuring was done outside of bankruptcy.
#149
ALPA and Air Tran's MEC got a warm cup of "Shut the he'll up!" from SWAPA's MEC. So, looks like neither one is a good idea.
Who will win in the M&A? Guys have already posted, and Fins supports this too, business. Business will win and $ will drive it.
#150
Today, Uncle Dave B is going to give me $2mil to use during a M&A event. Tomorrow? He could take that away. (5 Docs)
ALPA and Air Tran's MEC got a warm cup of "Shut the he'll up!" from SWAPA's MEC. So, looks like neither one is a good idea.
Who will win in the M&A? Guys have already posted, and Fins supports this too, business. Business will win and $ will drive it.
ALPA and Air Tran's MEC got a warm cup of "Shut the he'll up!" from SWAPA's MEC. So, looks like neither one is a good idea.
Who will win in the M&A? Guys have already posted, and Fins supports this too, business. Business will win and $ will drive it.
Where is that 2 mil?
Is it in escrow?
Why not?
How would you get it?
Why is it still only 2 mil despite a larger Pilot group?
How much would you personally get?
And, you prefer this to the Mcaskill Bond that union Pilots have?
Here you are again trying to "show boat" with your contrarian phantom DR benefits.
JJ
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