cmesoar

Here is a question. I really have not heard any support from DAL or UAL. These are supposed to be in our peer set but if we vote in this association, are they going to look down on us from their top group A? ALPA has given me NO information on how we will be placed in their priority. I strongly believe this is what management will use when we negotiate for years under section six. As a matter of fact, ALPA has given me no information at all really, just some talking points on how this is better for us and a magazine article. Hear me out, if we are looked at on the same level as a large regional or better, Spirit, you can throw our current peer set out the window. This management team will run with it. I want answers from ALPA. Nothing really matters yet since we are on day 2, and I don't have a ballot anyway. I bet DAL would have had their ballots on time.. Ok after my tiny rant, I am still pro CBA as I believe the DR is a failed model that I would not even wipe my A$$ with.

likeitis

2 million? Really? Have you looked at the rates these lawyers charge? You will need no less than double that. And yes ALPA national will foot a good share of it

pilot772

What JJ said that $2 million is fictional and only available after the fact. I.e- several years post merger you can apply for reimbursement of your portion. Somewhere around $780. Notice how we have added almost 300 pilots to the list but that number hasn't increased? Also dig through your emails and read the one from early February from the M and A committee. Very interesting reading, on a side note they have asked management to recognize that committee (or any committee appointed by the PVC) to serve as a merger committee should it happen. The company flat out denied that request as it wouldn't be flexible enough for the DR. Trust me that money you think is there is not. Again I ask call any current committee member or PVC member and start asking questions. I think you would be quite surprised.

Fins Up

Look at Hawaiian and Alaska Airlines. They are both smaller pilot groups than us, are ALPA, and have better contracts. I'd say they both have just as good a relationship with their management, probably better, than we have right now.

It's hard for ALPA to set goals for a first contract for us since it will be US jetblue pilots deciding what we want and what our priorities our. It wouldn't surprise me if our management tries to give us some sh!tty contract but I really don't think they'll have a leg to stand on. Should it go to arbitration, how would they justify agreeing to anything less than we have now when we are still well below average with our combined comp-benefits package?

The idea of "five to six years negotiations" is one of the biggest scare tactics the company will use. Groups in our peer set are getting their contracts done much quicker these days - even before the amendable date passes in some cases. I have to as you this: Do you plan on making jetblue for a career? If so, you need to think long term. A few years to get a good solid, enforceable contract is a small price (in my mind anyway). If you are not planning on staying here then please don't hamstring the rest of the pilot group be helping management maintain total control over our lives. You can always abstain if you're not sure what the best course is.

Everything you read here is amateur speculation on a chat board. If you would like answers to your specific concerns, I recommend contacting Ron Rindfleisch. He is the Organizing Committees representative from ALPA. I have talked to him several times and he is a great guy. Not pushy. He'll just answer your questions. His contact info is:
Ron “Rino” Rindfleisch
ALPA Organizing
703-689-4179 Office
[email protected]

I'm on the OC but I am certainly no expert in any of this stuff. Feel free to PM me as well if you like. If I don't have answers, I'll find someone who does.

Thanks.

pilot772

You realize this is a NMB thing not an ALPA thing right. The rules state the first day of the election the NMB mails out the ballots. No one would have had them the first day.

P-3Bubba

With the DR and ELT promises, I'm not holding my breath on what will come down during an M&A. $2mil or whatever committee, it will all be decided then and be based on the situation and terms of the M&A.

ALPA will gladly pay for M&A issues and has the financial and legal team to be present. However, you pay for this service. 1.9%. To a senior captain thats a noticeable deduction, and to a junior FO it could be the tuition for his wife's nursing school.

DALPA and FedEx ALPA could care less about Hawaiian, Jetblue, Alaska or Spirit. Spirit is a hero because they went on strike and won a sub-peer set average contract.

cmesoar

Ok I was not aware of that. I stand corrected.

sailingfun

One thing you need to keep in mind is that the RLA forbids a national union. ALPA is a association. They will provide assistance and a framework for your union which will be JetBlueAlpa. Your union will operate as it's own entity so it will be as good or bad as the people you elect to office. Also keep in mind ALPA does not control the election process. The NMB handles that. You should get a card shortly.

cmesoar

I plan on staying here long term. I will vote and I will vote yes. However, I am just trying to figure out ALPAs support for JB. Yes we will negotiate our contract and go our own way with that regard. However, we will need all the support we need in an acquisition or merger. 2 million will be chump change when it comes to 2600 + pilots. We will need a lot more support than this management is giving us. I am in the bottom 50% and like I said, I want to stay here. I will contact the OC. I am all for third party to obtain a CBA, I just don't trust the ALPA national politics. U mention Alaska and Hawaian. I honestly am not familiar with their scope and merger protections. That may be something we will have to look at later as they will most likely be our peer set. I just don't get the feeling DAL and UAL will be comparable under the almighty eyes of national. I hope I am wrong. Again, I am a Yes vote. Thanks

benzoate

AirTran began negotiating with Swa under its in house labor contract. The in house contract did not require a merger of operations. The ALPA contract was voted in after the negotiations began. In house contract took precedent.

Swa did not buy AirTran. Guadalupe holdings bought AirTran.

ALPA did the best it could but it could not force anything. This is why it is so important to close that loophole in our first contract.