CVG767A

I'm wondering why we need to do this merger at all. Delta serves Tokyo, Seoul, and (soon) Shanghai. Looking at the DOT's website, it looks like we have authority to serve Hong Kong, Taipei, Singapore, Osaka, Fukuoka, Nagoya, and Bangkok. This may not be as comprehensive as what NWA has to offer, but it's not bad. I don't know that the Tokyo hub matches Delta's route philosophy; we dismantled our Frankfurt hub in favor of offering nonstops from the U.S.

Are we simply lacking aircraft, or is there another element I'm missing? If aircraft is the issue, more 777LRs are on the way this year.

http://ostpxweb.dot.gov/aviation/intav/carrier.pdf

sully606

I spent about 4 hours this week wit my LEC reps and they had anwsers to these questions and many more. The reps are suppose to be in the lounges this week. I'd rather not try to anwser on an open forum.

nwaf16dude

I've seen estimates that say it would take 20+ years (and a whole truckload of money) to build an asian network equivalent to what NWA has. Gates, gate agents, baggage handlers, mechs, ground equipment, sales staff, etc... Airplanes and crews are only the tip of a very large iceberg.

Just for example, United paid Pan Am 750 million in 1985 for their Pacific operation, and that only included 18 airplanes. They were buying a lot more than just airplanes.

Access is still the biggest issue. Delta has no China access other than Hong Kong. That's where the real money is, and access to china doesn't happen overnight. I have a good friend who makes his living "consulting" over there. His services are basically telling american companies who they need to bribe to get anything done.

Bangkok and Singapore are good markets, but they work much better in conjunction with the Narita hub because it's just too far away from the US. Who wants to take a 16+ hour flight? (8770nm SIN-LAX)

reddog25

DAL Dude...If all you want to do is take ATL or LAX pax to NRT or other asian countries you can do that with the -777 or 787. So with out the ability to pick up Japanese pax in NRT and take them to SIN or MNL you'll be stuck with flying 225 seat airplanes flying US passenegers. Certainly do-able. The NWA connection comes from 5th freedom routes picking up a Japanese national and taking him to SIN or NRT. That's why you need the merger, and we don't

Justdoinmyjob

Two points.
1. Delta doesn't fly to Hong Kong. We are however strting Atlanta-Shanghi in 2009. We already have the route authority and have applied for ATL/BEI.

2. As an Expat who lived in Singapore for over a decade, we would pay more to fly SIN/LAX than waste time transitting Japan. It cut over a day out of travel time. Businessmen don't like wasting that time and those flights were full of them, thats who.

nwaf16dude

Just saw that Hong Kong route authority on the web site, didn't know Delta wasn't using it. Obviously, there are a lot of unused authorites on there.

Okay, guess what I meant was I don't want to be on a 16 hour flight...unless I'm driving.

sully606

That last sentence was TIC right?

I agree that access to Asia is a huge part of this deal and will save Delta 20 years to duplicate but it's not the only thing that is driving this. The analysis that the companies and ALPA have done, if correct, would indicate that 1+1=3.
Do any NW pilots know what your Seniority list proposal for the merger was?

nwaf16dude

There hasn't been any official communication from the union with any details of our proposal. There are lots of rumors, but none that I would lend any creedence to.

reddog25

[QUOTE=sully606;332116]That last sentence was TIC right?QUOTE]

Nope. I only have 7 years left at NWA, so my worst case is that I will remain an A-320 CA. Not a bad way to make a living. Those below me though have a lot to lose. What I am saying, there is no motivation for NWA pilots to sell out our senioroty. I've said it before and I'll say it again, if the managements of NWA and DAL want this to happen it will happen regardless of what pilots north and south of themason-dixon line want. Relax, it will happen, then we can worry about the SLI.

sully606

[quote=reddog25;332132]If we don't know where the two sides stand in regards to the SLI then how can we even make a determination whether the deal as a whole is worth doing? How do you know Delta needs this more than NW and why does that matter in this discussion? What have you heard directly form your reps? Do you trust your MEC to do the right thing and give you accurate info?

A lot questions. I have had most of these anwsered from my reps and I trust them. I will not discuss specifics on an open forum but until accurate info is presented to the respective pilot groups it is difficult to make many of these assumptions.

I am relaxed. At this point I'd just as soon stay single but if this thing is going to happen with or without us I'd rather have the money, retirement and an agreed to SLI than nothing and an arbitrated SLI.

During the 17 or so years of the NW/Rep fence I heard that there were 26 arbitrated decisions. Has the committee that is responsible for this ever come to an agreement outside of arbitration? I also heard that the committee chairman as been in this job the entire time. Is this true?