NWA and DAL back on track
04-04-2008, 12:39 PM
#82
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left seat of a little plane
Posts: 2,397
Originally Posted by SCRWDbyMGMT
Before age 65 became law, 99% of the guys I fly with at NW wanted to retire NLT 60. With about 95% of those wanting to leave NLT age 58.
Since age 65 BECAME LAW (Thanks again ALPA!!!)
Since age 65 BECAME LAW (Thanks again ALPA!!!)
What I find most amusing is how the APA put out public press releases opposing the repeal of Age 60...and their own district's congressional delegation still voted for Age 65! As they frequently do, the APA made a "feel-good" statement that did nothing for the real world in which we live, but did tell the same crowd what they wanted to hear--even though no tangible results ensued.
So you probably think that I like Age 65. I do not. I do, however, acknowledge the real world, warts and all. In this instance, so too did ALPA. Neither ALPA nor any other entity could have stopped Age 65, any more than the poor 8-year-old kid you see in the video of the Indonesian tsunami could have stood against the mammoth wall of water overtaking him.
But, by acknowledging the real world, and where ALPA could show some influence, we helped insure that the legislation crafted prevented already retired pilots from coming back to their old seniority, among other things.
Blame ALPA for much, I agree. Age 65, however, is not part of that.
04-04-2008, 08:50 PM
#83
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,989
Originally Posted by nw320driver
Our contract does not allow for it as written (I just checked), but then there are some exceptions and LOAs. Delta and Continental are allowed to do some flying under the code-share agreements with limits. I am sure a good lawyer could find some wiggle room, but I'm not a lawyer. With all the doom and gloom being put out in the papers, they could use this to their advantage. Just my thoughts on the another angle management might try to pursue. Kind of interim agreement, while in they keep working long term on a full merger.
We need to move scope, merger and fragmentation to the top of the priority list in this ITA, if it happens.
Delta Flight Operations management is remaining the course and says the merger is not a good idea due to the fleet and the availability of new 777-200LR (they love that plane), supposed to be 45 in out future.
Dutied out tonight next to Delta's VP of FO on the computer, he was searching for news like we are. So if anything came out of the Delta BOD meeting this week, I get the feeling it has not been been communicated to the Generals yet.
04-04-2008, 10:24 PM
#84
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
Dutied out tonight next to Delta's VP of FO on the computer, he was searching for news like we are. So if anything came out of the Delta BOD meeting this week, I get the feeling it has not been been communicated to the Generals yet.
You mean Majors/Lieutenant-commanders, don't you? You don't really think those guys actually have input into what goes on? They are lap-dogs/bag-men for senior management...
Kevin
04-05-2008, 06:17 AM
#85
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,273
Here are the rumors. RA has the boards support in not doing a merger unless the pilot issues are handled in advance. RA told the CP's last week he would not do the deal unless he had a seniority list the Delta pilots could live with. I have a lot of friends at NWA. To a man they stated you may not like what RA says or the direction he takes but if he tells you something he sticks to his word. Hopefully we can all take a deep breath and relax now. I think the NWA/Delta merger is finally dead and buried. Lets move on to making both airlines successful on their own.
04-05-2008, 09:15 AM
#86
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: 330Fo
Posts: 215
Dead and buried until Monday. If you think that mega mergers aren't in the works in the near future I would guess again. NWA has 3.1 Billion cash on hand and DAL has close to that thus giving the combined company 6 Billion plus the 750M-1B AirFrance/KLM are investing would give the combined company 7B cash on hand. The storm that is headed the airlines way has never been faced before. Normally, with a slow down in the economy, oil prices retreat. That is not going to happen this time due to many factors, emerging markets, peak oil ??, weak dollar etc.
So, if anyone thinks either the DAL mec or NWA mec can derail this merger then not only do they not have history on their side they ignoring the desires of the hedge funds and investors. So, if it is not DAL/NWA then it will be DAL and somebody or NWA and somebody.
So, if anyone thinks either the DAL mec or NWA mec can derail this merger then not only do they not have history on their side they ignoring the desires of the hedge funds and investors. So, if it is not DAL/NWA then it will be DAL and somebody or NWA and somebody.
04-06-2008, 02:33 PM
#88
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Originally Posted by Opus
Dead and buried until Monday. If you think that mega mergers aren't in the works in the near future I would guess again. NWA has 3.1 Billion cash on hand and DAL has close to that thus giving the combined company 6 Billion plus the 750M-1B AirFrance/KLM are investing would give the combined company 7B cash on hand. The storm that is headed the airlines way has never been faced before. Normally, with a slow down in the economy, oil prices retreat. That is not going to happen this time due to many factors, emerging markets, peak oil ??, weak dollar etc.
So, if anyone thinks either the DAL mec or NWA mec can derail this merger then not only do they not have history on their side they ignoring the desires of the hedge funds and investors. So, if it is not DAL/NWA then it will be DAL and somebody or NWA and somebody.
So, if anyone thinks either the DAL mec or NWA mec can derail this merger then not only do they not have history on their side they ignoring the desires of the hedge funds and investors. So, if it is not DAL/NWA then it will be DAL and somebody or NWA and somebody.
IF it happens it will be when we least expect it, then it has to get the green light from the DOJ AND there will be a lot of opposition from some politicians. It's gonna be a while before it happens. It was already supposed to happen in January, and here it is in April and still nothing.
04-06-2008, 03:47 PM
#89
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: 330Fo
Posts: 215
from ft.com (financial times)
Executives at Minnesota-based Northwest have since put pressure on their counterparts at Delta to proceed without the pilots' support.
Delta's board members, who convened a meeting late last week to discuss the company's options, agreed to press ahead with negotiations, the people said. Those talks are now intensifying, with the two sides set to meet again this week, they said.
Delta and Northwest declined to comment.
As part of the previous talks, the two carriers agreed to swap Northwest shares for those of Delta at little or no premium, appoint Richard Anderson, Delta's chief executive, as the combined company's chief executive and keep the headquarters in Delta's hometown of Atlanta, the people said.
They also hammered out a new, $2bn labour accord that would have given pilots pay raises and a 5 per cent equity stake in a combined company.
But by late February, the two labour groups broke off negotiations without agreement. Representatives from each union met again in March to no avail, and Delta's pilots rejected the Northwest union's proposal to seek arbitration for a solution to the seniority stalemate.
Delta's public assurances that it would not proceed with any deal that would sacrifice job security and seniority benefits, along with the pilots' impasse, appeared to thwart the two airlines' plans. The companies had sought to line up the pilots' accord to help avoid the acrimony and protracted negotiations that often slows down airlines' effort to integrate.
The industry's outlook has since darkened, forcing Delta's executives and board members to consider leaving negotiations with the pilots until after they reach an agreement to merge.
Delta and Northwest each recently announced plans to trim domestic capacity, reducing the size of their fleets, to reduce costs.
Executives at Minnesota-based Northwest have since put pressure on their counterparts at Delta to proceed without the pilots' support.
Delta's board members, who convened a meeting late last week to discuss the company's options, agreed to press ahead with negotiations, the people said. Those talks are now intensifying, with the two sides set to meet again this week, they said.
Delta and Northwest declined to comment.
As part of the previous talks, the two carriers agreed to swap Northwest shares for those of Delta at little or no premium, appoint Richard Anderson, Delta's chief executive, as the combined company's chief executive and keep the headquarters in Delta's hometown of Atlanta, the people said.
They also hammered out a new, $2bn labour accord that would have given pilots pay raises and a 5 per cent equity stake in a combined company.
But by late February, the two labour groups broke off negotiations without agreement. Representatives from each union met again in March to no avail, and Delta's pilots rejected the Northwest union's proposal to seek arbitration for a solution to the seniority stalemate.
Delta's public assurances that it would not proceed with any deal that would sacrifice job security and seniority benefits, along with the pilots' impasse, appeared to thwart the two airlines' plans. The companies had sought to line up the pilots' accord to help avoid the acrimony and protracted negotiations that often slows down airlines' effort to integrate.
The industry's outlook has since darkened, forcing Delta's executives and board members to consider leaving negotiations with the pilots until after they reach an agreement to merge.
Delta and Northwest each recently announced plans to trim domestic capacity, reducing the size of their fleets, to reduce costs.
04-07-2008, 03:45 PM
#90
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Originally Posted by Opus
from ft.com (financial times)
Executives at Minnesota-based Northwest have since put pressure on their counterparts at Delta to proceed without the pilots' support.
Delta's board members, who convened a meeting late last week to discuss the company's options, agreed to press ahead with negotiations, the people said. Those talks are now intensifying, with the two sides set to meet again this week, they said.
Delta and Northwest declined to comment.
As part of the previous talks, the two carriers agreed to swap Northwest shares for those of Delta at little or no premium, appoint Richard Anderson, Delta's chief executive, as the combined company's chief executive and keep the headquarters in Delta's hometown of Atlanta, the people said.
They also hammered out a new, $2bn labour accord that would have given pilots pay raises and a 5 per cent equity stake in a combined company.
But by late February, the two labour groups broke off negotiations without agreement. Representatives from each union met again in March to no avail, and Delta's pilots rejected the Northwest union's proposal to seek arbitration for a solution to the seniority stalemate.
Delta's public assurances that it would not proceed with any deal that would sacrifice job security and seniority benefits, along with the pilots' impasse, appeared to thwart the two airlines' plans. The companies had sought to line up the pilots' accord to help avoid the acrimony and protracted negotiations that often slows down airlines' effort to integrate.
The industry's outlook has since darkened, forcing Delta's executives and board members to consider leaving negotiations with the pilots until after they reach an agreement to merge.
Delta and Northwest each recently announced plans to trim domestic capacity, reducing the size of their fleets, to reduce costs.
Executives at Minnesota-based Northwest have since put pressure on their counterparts at Delta to proceed without the pilots' support.
Delta's board members, who convened a meeting late last week to discuss the company's options, agreed to press ahead with negotiations, the people said. Those talks are now intensifying, with the two sides set to meet again this week, they said.
Delta and Northwest declined to comment.
As part of the previous talks, the two carriers agreed to swap Northwest shares for those of Delta at little or no premium, appoint Richard Anderson, Delta's chief executive, as the combined company's chief executive and keep the headquarters in Delta's hometown of Atlanta, the people said.
They also hammered out a new, $2bn labour accord that would have given pilots pay raises and a 5 per cent equity stake in a combined company.
But by late February, the two labour groups broke off negotiations without agreement. Representatives from each union met again in March to no avail, and Delta's pilots rejected the Northwest union's proposal to seek arbitration for a solution to the seniority stalemate.
Delta's public assurances that it would not proceed with any deal that would sacrifice job security and seniority benefits, along with the pilots' impasse, appeared to thwart the two airlines' plans. The companies had sought to line up the pilots' accord to help avoid the acrimony and protracted negotiations that often slows down airlines' effort to integrate.
The industry's outlook has since darkened, forcing Delta's executives and board members to consider leaving negotiations with the pilots until after they reach an agreement to merge.
Delta and Northwest each recently announced plans to trim domestic capacity, reducing the size of their fleets, to reduce costs.
Your point? Of course hedge fund people are putting pressure on, they're like the kid in the grocery store that doesn't get the candy he wants. Just because they're crying AND screaming now doesn't mean it will happen.
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