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Old 05-20-2008, 09:54 AM   #351  
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Yes, they are. If you go to http://dal.alpa.org and sign in it is on the front page.

It was also e-mailed last night if you get the e-mail alerts.
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Old 05-20-2008, 10:06 AM   #352  
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Veritas
In Defense of the Truth
#2008-02
When your only tool is a hammer, all of your problems start to look like nails.
The Northwest MEC Leadership seems to know only one way of doing business—fight. Unfortunately, that tactic may not only be unnecessary, but in the long term may foster the hostility they themselves warn could doom the prospects of the merged corporation.
As you will soon read, even if there is no villain, they seem bound and determined to find one.
We continue to be disappointed by the Northwest MEC’s decision to play fast and loose with the truth. It serves no purpose other than to pander to the Northwest pilots and to drive a wedge between our two pilot groups as we attempt to resume negotiations toward a joint contract.
Congressional interest in the proposed merger between Delta and Northwest was front and center this past week as both MEC chairmen testified before the U.S. House of Representatives’ Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure, Subcommittee on Aviation. This was the last of four congressional hearings on the matter and the first to receive direct testimony from the two master chairmen.
It didn’t take long for the Northwest MEC administration to start tilting at windmills in an effort to find their imaginary villain. The latest effort was published in an NWA MEC Hotline dated Thursday, May 15, 2008—the day after the hearing.
Here is what was reported to the Northwest pilots:
“In all communications over the past week we had requested the presence of Northwest pilots at this hearing as a symbol of opposition to this merger. However, DAL management hired as many as 50 linestanders, restricting the number of positions for Northwest pilots. It is unfortunate that, in a hearing regarding two ALPA carriers, the financial ability of Delta Air Lines can allow funds to block our full participation at an event that discusses the impact of consolidation.”
“A half-truth is a whole lie.”
--Old Yiddish Proverb
So enough of the half-truths; now (in our best Paul Harvey voice), “the rest of the story.”
Hearings on “The Hill” can be a hot ticket. The hearing rooms are small, seating limited, and the number of organizations with “skin in the game” numerous. Throw in witnesses and their supporting attorneys and staff, high-powered lobbyists, people like us “in the crosshairs,” and what you can have is a colossal food-fight for seats. Who gets in is tightly—and we mean very tightly—controlled by the Sergeant-at-Arms, a person who has
Veritas is published by the Delta MEC Communications Committee
ultimate authority over who enters and who is turned away. In order to secure one of the limited seats available after witnesses and staff are accommodated, it is a very common practice to hire “linestanders,” locals who will hold a spot in line, often starting the evening before.
Delta hired approximately 50 linestanders for this event who did in fact come the evening before. But here’s the irony of the Northwest MEC Hotline and the part they conveniently left out:
The linestanders were not hired to keep Northwest pilots out—but to ensure that they got IN!!
Let us explain.
Each witness is typically allowed two guests to accompany him into the room. Northwest MEC Chairman Dave Stevens elected to have two pilot members of his Communications Committee accompany him. All other Northwest pilots were subject to the “first-come, first serve” process. The Northwest MEC did encourage their pilots to attend the hearing, but apparently didn’t have enough experience with Capitol Hill to understand that you don’t just show up mid-morning on the day of the hearing and expect to waltz right into the hearing room. That explains the surprise on the faces of many Northwest pilots when they strolled into the Rayburn House Office Building only to find themselves at the end of a very long line of people ahead of them—Delta pilots, other Delta employees, a large number of Northwest employees from various departments, IAM supporters, AFA supporters and many others whose affiliation was not apparent.
As the crowd gathered outside the hearing room, Delta MEC volunteers and Delta’s Government Affairs people worked diligently together to ensure that there was a mix of Delta and Northwest uniforms in the line, with the goal being—and this was stated clearly to all in earshot—that there would be the same number of Northwest and Delta pilot uniforms in the room. Some got in. Some did not. Several Delta pilots did not get in initially because they volunteered to give up their place in line so that Northwest pilots could get in. Many employees of both airlines watched the initial portion of the hearing from an overflow room, but by the time the two master chairmen testified (the third panel of a four panel hearing), all Northwest and Delta pilots in attendance were able to be accomodated in the hearing room. Any claim to the contrary is fiction.
Oddly, the author of the Hotline accusing manipulation of the process not only did get in, but was a witness to the entire process. Did he not notice the Northwest pilots being moved into line with Delta pilots? Did he not do a uniform count in the room? Did he not notice the wall of NWA pilot uniforms on the back wall? Here’s a Hotline update: The only reason many Northwest pilots were allowed in the room at the beginning of the hearing was because of the foresight of Delta’s Government Affairs office to employ linestanders and the cooperative efforts of the Delta MEC to ensure an equitable presence.
“A half-truth is the most cowardly of lies”
--Author unknown
By painting a picture of conflict that does not exist, the Northwest MEC leadership is doing an enormous disservice to the pilots they represent and putting those pilots’ futures in jeopardy. Make no mistake about this fact—the success of the merged corporation depends largely on cooperation between the employee groups. Sowing discord for political gain is the lowest form of leadership.
Veritas is published by the Delta MEC Communications Committee
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Old 05-20-2008, 11:43 AM   #353  
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Originally Posted by acl65pilot View Post
Yes, they are. If you go to http://dal.alpa.org and sign in it is on the front page.

It was also e-mailed last night if you get the e-mail alerts.
Got it...thanks acl...

good to see DALPA isn't going to roll over for NALPA's bullying. Hopefully the average NWA pilots will see through their MEC's clumsy attempt to pass the buck for their badly botched negotiations earlier this year.

Last edited by Spaceman Spliff; 05-20-2008 at 11:52 AM.
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Old 05-20-2008, 11:43 AM   #354  
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Here we go again. NWA pilots are "cowardly liars" and otherwise incompetent fools to be pitied.

Have you noticed that everything DALPA does is so misunderstood? LOA 19 was as much for NWA pilots as it was for DAL pilots yet nobody seems to agree with that except DAL pilots. Since NWA is so inexperienced in the business of Washington DC, DAL hires line standers to make sure NWA pilots get in - yet nobody but DAL understands. DALPA talks about how graciously they treated pilots from airlines they have merged with, yet pilots posts here telling us that when it comes to Delta pilots "DO NOT TRUST THEM!" So very misunderstood.

Here is what you guys don't seem to understand. Just because you post something from DALPA, it doesn't mean everyone else in the industry must accept it as actual fact. I know you guys do for the most part, but none of the rest of us do. Apparently you guys think that makes us cowardly liars, but the history of DALPA and mergers is one of needing to keep your eyes wide open if you are the group that is being acquired.

The big concern at NWALPA is that despite DALPA's claims of wanting to get things done as quickly as possible, DALPA really just wants the Pacific routes and as few NWA pilots as possible. That is the prevailing concern. DALPA could stop that in a heartbeat by actually pressing for agreements as opposed to "cowardly liars" name calling.

Ronald Reagan once said: "Trust, but verify" when it came to the Soviet Union. NWA pilots have been watching the feet of DALPA not listening to the words. We're waiting for DALPA to walk the walk. Since we have not seen it yet, many of us are thinking the merger should be abandoned. Continental needs Pacific routes and they are also a very healthy company. I think we need to look at another merger partner that doesn't hold us in such terribly low esteem.

Carl
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Old 05-20-2008, 11:51 AM   #355  
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And now for something completely different. I had to re-read this several times and my wife found this so hysterical, she made me read it to her several times before bed while she laughed hysterically. You really couldn't make this up.

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...t_charged.html

This will help bring a moment of levity to these merger discussions. Just remember, if you think our lives in the merger are bad, somebody else is having a worse day.
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:01 PM   #356  
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Here we go again. NWA pilots are "cowardly liars" and otherwise incompetent fools to be pitied.

Have you noticed that everything DALPA does is so misunderstood? LOA 19 was as much for NWA pilots as it was for DAL pilots yet nobody seems to agree with that except DAL pilots. Since NWA is so inexperienced in the business of Washington DC, DAL hires line standers to make sure NWA pilots get in - yet nobody but DAL understands. DALPA talks about how graciously they treated pilots from airlines they have merged with, yet pilots posts here telling us that when it comes to Delta pilots "DO NOT TRUST THEM!" So very misunderstood.

Here is what you guys don't seem to understand. Just because you post something from DALPA, it doesn't mean everyone else in the industry must accept it as actual fact. I know you guys do for the most part, but none of the rest of us do. Apparently you guys think that makes us cowardly liars, but the history of DALPA and mergers is one of needing to keep your eyes wide open if you are the group that is being acquired.

The big concern at NWALPA is that despite DALPA's claims of wanting to get things done as quickly as possible, DALPA really just wants the Pacific routes and as few NWA pilots as possible. That is the prevailing concern. DALPA could stop that in a heartbeat by actually pressing for agreements as opposed to "cowardly liars" name calling.

Ronald Reagan once said: "Trust, but verify" when it came to the Soviet Union. NWA pilots have been watching the feet of DALPA not listening to the words. We're waiting for DALPA to walk the walk. Since we have not seen it yet, many of us are thinking the merger should be abandoned. Continental needs Pacific routes and they are also a very healthy company. I think we need to look at another merger partner that doesn't hold us in such terribly low esteem.

Carl
Yeah, the billions that the hedge funds, bankers and lawyers are going to make will take that into consideration. One could argue it would be better to be merged into a more powerful entity than have a hedge fund buy you and then break up the pieces. DAL is No. 1 to Europe, Africa, Middle East and No. 2 to Central and South America. NWA is No. 1 in Japan and No. 2 in Asia. Yet both our market values are around $2.4 billion today. Do you not think the vultures aren't salivating over wanting to buy the whole for pennies and sell the assets for billions more? Take a look at what Icahn and the rest of them do.

They have, can and will do this at some point. NWALPA has publicly slammed DALPA at every opportunity so far. DALPA responded on this latest disparage. I'm not trying to say who is right or wrong but if you are looking for respect look in the mirror and your fellow pilots. They're the only one's who care about you. You are a cog in a wheel in a profession that long ago was given up by the public.

CAL wants nothing to do with a merger. They have publicly stated that and their board endorsed it. They do want those routes. I believe they are waiting for a CH.11 filing by UAL and then they will swoop in for the kill. I'm a bit nervous that no other carriers are pursuing the merger game. Either NWA/DAL is the best in town, or the others are realizing that the costs could outweigh the benefits. If the merger is consummated, the vitriolic relationship between NWALPA/DALPA must stop or we will kill ourselves. I still have 29 years to go and don't want to see this happen.
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:23 PM   #357  
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Yeah, the billions that the hedge funds, bankers and lawyers are going to make will take that into consideration. One could argue it would be better to be merged into a more powerful entity than have a hedge fund buy you and then break up the pieces. DAL is No. 1 to Europe, Africa, Middle East and No. 2 to Central and South America. NWA is No. 1 in Japan and No. 2 in Asia. Yet both our market values are around $2.4 billion today. Do you not think the vultures aren't salivating over wanting to buy the whole for pennies and sell the assets for billions more? Take a look at what Icahn and the rest of them do.

They have, can and will do this at some point. NWALPA has publicly slammed DALPA at every opportunity so far. DALPA responded on this latest disparage. I'm not trying to say who is right or wrong but if you are looking for respect look in the mirror and your fellow pilots. They're the only one's who care about you. You are a cog in a wheel in a profession that long ago was given up by the public.

CAL wants nothing to do with a merger. They have publicly stated that and their board endorsed it. They do want those routes. I believe they are waiting for a CH.11 filing by UAL and then they will swoop in for the kill. I'm a bit nervous that no other carriers are pursuing the merger game. Either NWA/DAL is the best in town, or the others are realizing that the costs could outweigh the benefits. If the merger is consummated, the vitriolic relationship between NWALPA/DALPA must stop or we will kill ourselves. I still have 29 years to go and don't want to see this happen.
Take a look at our stock prices. The hedge funds and investment banks are getting killed by their investments in our stocks. There is virtually no hope for them to realize anything but big losses. In my opinion, the hedge funds have lost all of their ability to pressure Anderson and Steenland. And while I never assumed any hedge fund would care what I think, I do think there is a fundamental disrespect for what NWA brings to the merger. It shows over and over again on these forums and in what I read from both DALPA and NWALPA. I simply think another corporate combination would be better for NWA. Delta's stock is sinking so fast, you may not be in a position to acquire anybody with a stock swap.

Not at all worried about a Carl Icahn style break up. The only way that could happen is if we were in a liquidation situation. We have as much unrestricted cash as Delta and we are much smaller with lower costs. There will be many other airline liquidations before NWA gets there, and given the numbers, Delta would go before NWA.

Carl
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:41 PM   #358  
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Here we go again. NWA pilots are "cowardly liars"
You will notice my comment was directed at your manipulative MEC goodfellas, and not at your rank-and-file pilots. And I'm not accusing them of being cowardly.

Carl, are you an MEC or LEC guy?

Last edited by Spaceman Spliff; 05-20-2008 at 12:55 PM.
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:06 PM   #359  
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oh good more of the same old bs over and over again. Just like politics everyone just points fingers instead of fixing anything.

Lets get it over with quick, my MEC is better than your MEC and your MEC is better than my MEC, blah blah blah. Get it over with already.
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:07 PM   #360  
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You will notice my comment was directed at your manipulative MEC goodfellas, and not at your rank-and-file pilots. And I'm not accusing them of being cowardly.

Carl, are you an MEC or LEC guy?
You didn't call us cowardly, it was that Veritas In Defense of the Truth #2008-02 posted by acl65pilot.

The use of that word was a terrible mistake by DALPA. NWA pilots endured many strikes and lost a ton of income to hold the line against a management that continually wanted unwarranted salary cuts. NWA pilots are anything but cowardly, and anyone with the slightest knowledge of history knows it. If that document is real, DALPA needs to apologize for the use of that word immediately. DALPA may have just lost me completely.

I'm not on the MEC or LEC, just a line puke.

Carl
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